Citation
Interview with Pam Taylor, January 20, 1975

Material Information

Title:
Interview with Pam Taylor, January 20, 1975
Creator:
Taylor, Pam ( Interviewee )
Publication Date:
Language:
English

Subjects

Subjects / Keywords:
Urban Lumbee Oral History Collection ( local )

Notes

Funding:
This text has been transcribed from an audio or video oral history. Digitization was funded by a gift from Caleb J. and Michele B. Grimes.

Record Information

Source Institution:
Samuel Proctor Oral History Program, Department of History, University of Florida
Holding Location:
This interview is part of the 'Urban Lumbee' collection of interviews held by the Samuel Proctor Oral History Program of the Department of History at the University of Florida
Rights Management:
Made available under a Creative Commons Attribution Non-Commercial 4.0 International license: https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/.
Resource Identifier:
UL 10 ( SPOHP IDENTIFIER )

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UL 10A

Page 1.

INTERVIEWEE: Pam Taylor

INTERVIEWER: Lew Barton



B: We have another young lady here with us to be interviewed. Would

you mind telling us what your name is pt"- MA ?

T: I'm Pamela C. Taylor.

B: Pamela C. Taylor, T-a-y-l-o-r. How old are you, Pam?

T: Sixteen.

B: Sixteen, that's a nice age to be, isn't it? Do you enjoy being

sixteen?

T: Yes.

B: Have you got any boyfriends and girlfriends?

T: Yes.

B: Which do you have the most of?

T: Girlfriends.

B: Do you have any sports in school?

T: Yes, baseball.

B: Do you play on the girls team?

T: Uh--hfr* f 1 Ti-'1 (5C

B: t.UnWlt. Would you mind telling us the names of your parents?

T: Mildred Louise Taylor and James Stephen Taylor.

B: Would you mind telling us the names of your brothers and sisters

Me!a ahasEs and their ages?

T: James Stephen Taylor,Jr, age eighteen, Mary Louise Taylor, age fifteen,

and QBjaJ' Mae Taylor, age four.










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B: -eMfth, now which one are you? I mean are you the oldest?

T: No, I'm next to the oldest.

B: "1D&auhwela'Lt.foeol1-e. What grade are you in?

T: The eleventh.

B: Are you having any difficulties in school?

T:

B: S'ye^ are you doing tutoring work over here or., ririiju'M



T: No.

B: Do you live near the center here?

T: -Uh / 3

B: -f"tafk what street do you live on?

T: On Duncan.

B: On Duncan Street, D-u-n-c-a-n,

T: 44 rihX t-,N%, \j

B: How far is that from South Broadway?

T: About six or seven blocks.

B: iftS do you go to church?

T: at West Cross Street Baptist Church.

B: Were you over at the meeting last night by the way?

T: No.

B: They had a nice meeting over there last night. I was over there.

Do you have any problems with other young people, getting on with

other young people?










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' No.

B: Do they treat you any differently because you're an Indian?

T: Well, some of the schools
d0.
B: What do they, they have a tendency to shy away from you or make

remarks or anything like that?

T: Yes, and they CC({ J ad on Indians, most of them.

B: What do you feel about this?

T: I feel that we're all the sameno matter what your race is.

B: Right. Ba-yeu mkca an you remember any particular problems at

all in this connection?

T: Well, let's see. This girl and me)a-c, I was in the tenth grade

last year, and she made a remark about the Indians while we were

in history clasand that made me a little upset about it and I

told her tat, "D l r what she was saying __^_.'

Sen LLcr^ about i tt^^Il-jiuAr.-

told her that.. Luld take it outside.

B: Did she take you up on it?

T: No. C1 --' o

B: Do you think our Indian children are a little too sensitive about re-

marks like this?

T: No.

B: They take it pretty well?

ST: They take it pretty well.

B: Can you think of anything we could do to help along these lines afi-Cd

help people better understand each other and get along better together?










UL 10A

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T: No, can't think a W.

B: When they teach you in school, what place now?

T: The eleventh.

B: Have you studied anything at all about Indians in school?

T: 4Sa this year.

B: WmZaNt what course is that in?

T: Wi.a81i history.

B: "=PC th. You have counsellors in school?

T: Qmaii. ye >

B: They don't teach sex education?

T: Well, they did last year.

B: MU -hn4Y

T: We had sex education.

B: Do you think it was helpful, too?

T: inh-hn. -^

B: Do you think people of the community frown on this sort of thing maybe?

T: Most of them do.

B: Think they feel it shouldn't be taught?

T: Well not the younger ones,.the older ones like my dad. They think

it shouldn't be teaching in school. But if they don't teach them

in school/nobody else is going to teach it to them.

B: Right. If you have a personal problem you want to discuss and have nobody

to talk tocan you always go to your counselor?

T: Yes.

B: What's your favorite subject in school?










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T: U.S. history.

B: Do you think the Indians got eft out of history, too?

T: They don't really' ye7 I m.nriia:. 'l in history they

talk about the Negro s and the whites, and I don't think the Indians

should be left out Id ';'' .

B: Of course American history began with the American Indian.

T: Right.

B: And if you're told was a small group, I suppose you can

p l / C sometimes.

T: Yes.

B: Do you think there's anything that might be done to stimulate more

interest along these lines?

T: Yesy I can't think of none.

B: Do you think people would be interested in a course on American Indian



T: I think most of them would, because like at school, .yaSMesw, I told

a lot of my friends about Indian enter, and one night:about thirteen

or fourteen of them come down here and they liked it down here.

There was Indian dancing that night and most of them liked 25 gp

-gms c They said they'd like to do some beadwork now.

B: *4aiih, do you do this sort of thing, beadwork?

T:

B: Are you good at it?

T: Not good at it. I just learned over the summer when I was working down

here.










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B: Do you come over for the Indian dances on Thursday nights?

T: U-b 4

B: Do you dance?

T: No, my sister does, but I don't.

B: You don't dance Indian-style or otherwise?

T: Uh uh.

B: Just enjoy watching.

T: Right.

B: You and I are about in the same boat, but I want to learn

Indian danceS',

T: Well, I know a few steps / i& but I just like to sit

back and watch them do it.

B: fgiS, very colorful isn't it?

T: JlIMh.. \e-s

B: Very beautiful really, and I'll tell you one thing there's some

beautiful Indian girls out on the dance floor there, Don't

you think Indian girls are beautiful?

T: --f e-.

B: How about Indian guys?

T: Yes.

B: They're not beautiful, but maybe they're handsome.

T: Yes...right.

B: What do you plan to do when you get through school?

T: I want to go to college and go to nursing school.

B: Do you think you'll be able to make it?

T: Yes, I think so.










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B: What do you girls think about women's lib? Do you think our young

people are inclined to lean towards women's lib?

T: In a way I do. It'really doesn't make no sense, women's lib. T'STUt
howP
aJilsr t^aai_i they know they're going to get treated anyway,

so...

B: You don't think it's going to make.much difference?

T: No, it's not going to make much difference. It's like these women

that want to work construction. They work construction maybe two
0- :-t 7-I' 'etc
or three weeks. Tihey do nothing and...they just give up on it



B: I picked up the telephone the other day and I listened for a soft

feminine voice to say, "Number please." This guy's voice came on.

How do you feel about guys who serve as telephone operators?

T: I really don't know. (j '--

B: Do you think it's sort of a reaction to women's lib?

T: Yeb, it is.

B: Do you like things the way they were in the past?

T: Yes, they were better the way they were^ Women did women's work and

men did men's work.

B: I see. They're just not made the same are they?

T: No.

B: What do you think young people can do about the problems today? Do

yo6 think they have a good idea of which to do and all this?

T: Well, some of them have good ideas about things, but ggvgggy, really

it wouldn't matter that I did try to change it, because if it's going

to be changed it's going to be changed.










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B: And you don't thin young people dhoa have to say or do would

make much difference?

T: No, because older people-, p -Bf as just don't listen to younger

people. They might listen to them, but yr a1mm they don't take

their advice or nothing. It's just something that's going in-one

ear and coming out the other. But it really wouldn't make no dif-

ference if they tried to change it.

B: I don't know about that. I like to listen to young people. They

have great ideaS1 T

T: Yes.

B: Do you feel that these ideas are wasted time?

T: I feel most of them are.

B: Bi too bad, isn't it?

T: Yes.

B: Is there anything you would like to do? I take it you feel that there

is a generation gap. Is it very good to talk to older people?

T: Well, some older people are god3 lik- rI Y ..aM.MMa L, it's

hard for me to talk to my mother than it is to talk to myl t'

And-SUam Ioaybecan talk to my, one of my aunts better than I

can talk to my sister.

B: Do you think Indian parents are stricter than other people?

T: No, not really, because ymc --1- r ,y ,- -n' .ii. my parents/they usually

allow at least a little bit of freedom. Some things we want

1- (P-' they won't let us have our way about it, but with

other things they go along with.









UL 10A

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B: Do you think that people say sometimes "I don't know what's going to

happen to our young people." You don't see any difference, do you?

T: No, I don't.

B: I don't think there is any difference. The young people of yester-

day and the young people of today...

T: .y

B: ...perhaps some people, they have more money to spend and this

sort of thing. Do you think Indian children are very respectful

towards parents?

T: .,I a mhem, you know, they respect i faFC

and other people.

B: I think Indian children have beautiful manners.

T: -4-htih. y S

B: I wish we could do something about the generation gap, but I don't

see any generation gap between me and younger people'jl'__ (t_ C _

I really encourage young people ,i's a, to talk to me pretty

freely, -uasmsm, tell me things and just talk together. I really

don't see all that much difference d1WMCl- 'tAt e-.g'dh-

my friends ;lt., C all right, you don't know what you want to

do U,/ kv Vp r-,.
U iV
T: NOY

B: It might be a better one.

T: Right.

B: BUZM"h and then when you go into college...do you make pretty good

grades in school?

T: Yes, they're pretty good except for physical science.










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B: That's sort of a man's subject anyway, isn't it?

T: Yes

B: Guys get more interested in...

T: Right.

B: ...physical things "d girls I suppose the girls

beat them in some other areas C .Do you study

Home Ec.?

T: Yes.

B : Do you find it's a helpful subject?

T: Anyway I'd like the course -OeFrat w, like sewing and cooking. Z=e

there you gotP3y uM two things you can do. You could work

in a factoryaaS9MM, if you wanted to, making clothes or be

a cook or something like that I@@a( working in a nice restaurant.

B: Is there anything you'd like to pass on to other young people?

T: No.

B: I want to thank you so very much for this interview '



T: Thank you.

B: You're very, you're a nice _U_ eCt to interview. Thank you

so very much.
S Iwelcome.
T: 40enT welcome.





Full Text

PAGE 1

. UL lOA Page 1. INTERVIEWEE: Pam Taylor INTERVIEWER: Lew Barton B: We have another young lady here with us to be interviewed. Would you mind telling us what your name is) pfu.J.c. l'\'\~ "-"'' ? T: I'm Pamela C. Taylor. B: Pamela C. Taylor, T-a-y-1-o-r. How old are you, Pam? T: Sixteen. B: Sixteen, that's a nice age to be, isn't it? Do you enjoy being sixteen? T: Yes. B: Have you got any boyfriends and girlfriends? T: Yes. B: Which do you have the most of? T: Girlfriends. B: Do you have any sports in school? T: Yes, baseball. B: Do you play on the girls team? T: Uh-hulT-.G ffr-1 ,---fr~") '/ c5 B: -;.:Utt" litdt. Would you mind telling us the names of your parents? T: Mildred Louise Taylor and James Stephen Taylor. B: Would you mind telling us the names of your brothers and sisters aa1n.ls9!l!!l-S~ttllll!l!!l~S and their ages? T: James Stephen Taylor/Jr, age eighteen, Mary Louise Taylor, age fifteen, ~r/ln~ and M;tw;I~ Mae Taylor, age four.

PAGE 2

~--------UL lOA Page 2. dib B: !lift lid:, now which one are you? I mean are you the oldest? T: No, I'm next to the oldest. B: "1:1:1::;aul'"i we H:;...,-oe -tolo---me-. What grade are you in? T: The eleventh. B: Are you having any difficulties in school? ~*&'r,A'\0 ~"'1 V,,~~ 1 ol, T: m~ I C H I " I ., -tr_,... ... _.. . . _.\ ,-,vnCA. D +.t re, ;,,s B: e.re you doing tutoring work over here orsI I 1 5 ua're .. h-d-r-, ''St Q ,(IC T: No. B: Do you live near the center here? B : .. ~trh-:.la:m., ~at street do you live on? ::-T: B: B: T: B: T: B: T: On Duncan. 0 S .. ? n Duncan treet, D-u-n-c-a-n. How far is that from South Broadway? About six or seven blocks. 18;1 \bm,, do you go to church? Vt-cs.', "Eat West Cross Street Baptist Church. Were you over at the meeting last night/by the way? No. B: They had a nice meeting over there last night. I was over there. Do you have any problems with other young people, getting on with other young people?

PAGE 3

UL lOA Page 3. dib ']; B: T: B: T: B: T: No. Do they treat you Well, some of the d.o, any differently schoolst' because you're an Indian? What do theyA they have a tendency to shy away from you or make ,.,,,. remarks or anything like that? , Ce(f:,;i"lltf Yes, and theyre ,,bad on Indians, most of them. What do you feel about this? I feel that we're all the same 1 no matter what your race is. B: Right. Bo J OM lta, "'_an you remember any particular problems at all in this connection? T: Well, let's see. This girl and me)Ji-..~I was in the tenth grade last yea'9and she made a remark about the Indians while we weFe B: in history clas~ ~at made me a little upset about it 1 and I J told her ,-::;J!-_f.t14 c!~• -1'0 t.,.J/: ./ r what she was saying .b C-:..--:,•th./~-~ -. I I,.-~ ,, 1 ...... .. ~--~ . ' l ... ,,~!I ,.. .; . .... '/ ,,. .J.. ,, . •. ' r . ' I ,j c ... ... .... ,:) about i l(,;)Ut.,.r::-Jus't'.', ~J}crr.;;;; ,... ,. +:, ~--j t 1-..f' I"', b;~~1 i"f, 7.,i.J told her th~5ftcc:tng Hf)k>:fathcr bii'.ett~ta=+t: /\~uldtake it outside. Did she take you up on it? C 4""' T: No. ( l'---'-J :. { ...} B: Do you think our Indian children are a little too sensitive about re marks like this? T: No. B: They take it pretty well? , T: They take it pretty well. B: Can you think of anything we could do to help along these line9;::rm:,;...'10 help people better understand each other and get along better together?

PAGE 4

L UL lOA Page 4. dib T: B: T: B: T: B: T: No, can't think c:!l-f\Cil'\C When they teach you in school, what place now? The eleventh. Have you studied anything at all about Indians in school? 't C:> , e-+11d•, this year. what course is that in? fj.S, ~,r'istory. B: ~h.J>OYou have J'; counsellors in school? T: )!I~ B: T: B: T: They don't teach sex education? Well, they did last year. C ~(I .. -~ 1 t-..•-eJ ,1 t Uh huh: \ I, t , .:t, ' 7 We had sex education. B: Do you think it was helpful, too? (",.. (' f"~. ' -.. -...::'.:l, ,/ t" ... ,,._ T: Uh-httl'!-t'":"".fi1'~•., ,r, / --..1 B: Do you think people of the community frown on this sort of thing maybe? T: Most of them do. B: Think they fee~ it shouldn't be taught? ce;_ Io f c;,f -:JC-...t,,t}; .~.!.{I .... T: Wel11\not the younger ones, the older ones like my dad. They think it shouldn't be teaching in school. But if they don't teach them in school 1 nobody else is going to teach it to them. B: Right. If you have a personal problem you want to discuss and have nobody to talk to/can you always go to your counselor? T: Yes. B: What's your favorite subject in school?

PAGE 5

UL lOA Page 5. dib T: U.S. history. B: T: Do you think the Indians, ~ot \eft out of history, too? !t r, ,:1 c_ 4i\L. t r ,.x. u.(() . . They don't real-ly , , y;oa. kna1 , e Ht&.!@!!M.I; ,!_n history they talk about the Negro/sand the whites, arid I don't think the Indians I, J should be left out f'r/~_,.~;,,., .. . B: Of course American history began with the American Indian. T: Right. ....,:J_ B: And if you're told --'-~ __ was a small group, I suppose you can .• J .,, / ..... c'--~ tJ..c1r /1' 'J _ , :L sometimes. T: Yes. B: Do you think there's anything that might be done to stimulate more T: B: interest along these lines? YesY\I can't think of none. Do you think people would be interested in a course on American Indian e.,,I. r;~ c--::S1 'tAcll t C? T: I think most of them would, because like at school, J!. allla!l'I,, I told <}'le. a lot of my friends aboutl\Indian'1enter, and one night:about thirteen or fourteen of them come down here 1 and -they liked it down here. There was Indian dancing that night and most of them liked t9' e, li.Q!S.s They said they'd like to do some beadwork now. B: iliii?P>h, 4,p you do this sort of thing, beadwork? T: 'tih huh. G.(< ,n,• A•( ~, ;::l y LS B: Ate you good at it? '.r: Not good at .. it. r just learned over the summer when I was working down here.

PAGE 6

UL lOA Page 6. dib B: Do you come over for the Indian dances on Thursday nights? T: Ub...lwh .Gff tf\!~ 1,,~I-M;] '-f B: Do you dance? T: No, my sister does, but I don't. B: T: You. don't dance)Indian-style or otherwise? ,,.,.l-4 Uh uh. ~"S .~ ' 1 ':C...J NC:, B: J . h". -;> ust enJoy watc ing. T: Right. B: You and I are about in the same boat, but I want to learn Glo s~ Indian dance$""• T: Well, I know a few steps C .-( if , but I just like to sit back and watch them do it. ~+'~ B: ~. very colorful isn't it? T: JfllE!tuJ;i ye-s B: Very beautiful really, and I'll tell you one thi~ there's ) beautiful Indian girls out on the dance floor there! Don't you think Indian girls are beautiful? B: How about Indian guys? T: Yes. B: They're not beautiful, but maybe they're handsome. T: Yes right. B: What do you plan to do when you get through school? T: I want to go to college and go to nursing school. B: Do you think you'll be able to make it? T: Yes, I think so. some

PAGE 7

UL lOA Page 7. dib B: What do you girls think about women's lib? Do you think our young people are inclined to lean towards women's lib? T: In a way I do. It 'really doesn't make no sense, women's lib. 'i!idyS:iie holP @ll! iW :tc:: gH a awra i, ~hey know /\they' re going to get treated anyway, so B: You don't think it's going to make.much difference? T: No, it's not going to make much difference. It's like these women that want to work construction .They work construction maybe two o-:r:::-( 1 r.c or three weeks. Tb ey do nothing and they just gf..ve up on it ,cd:, eoaaou (/ _!io;, __ 1'~ "'h:: ~,,)...,~,' .~ ,r.r\ etAI~ ~t,;. 4rt ts/, ; .1 J;;bat's Rot se~\ti.ftg,e -.J,n \. C ' B: I picked up the telephone the other day 1 and I listened for a soft feminine voice to say, "Number please." This guy's voice came on. How do you feel about guys who serve as telephone operators? T: I really don't know. (fc.i...l.j f--~ B: Do you think it's sort of a reaction to women's lib? T: Ye, it is. B: T: Do you like things the way they were in the past? Yes, they were better the way they werQ Women did women's work and men did men's work. B: I see. They're just not made the same 1 are they? T: No. B: What do you think young people can do about the problems today? Do you think they have a good idea of which to do and all this? T: Well, some of them have good ideas about things, but .t!QiS!s;;;..r, really it wouldn't matter that I did try to change it, because if it's going to be changed it's going to be changed.

PAGE 8

UL lOA Page 8.
PAGE 9

UL lOA Page 9. dib B: Do you think that people say sometimes "I don't know what's going to happen to our young people." You don't see any difference, do you? T: No, I don't. B: I don't think there is any difference. The young people of yester day and the young people of today T: .:mt 1fflh.ye ::.::, B: perhaps some people, they have more money to spend and this sort of thing. Do you think Indian children are very respectful towards parents? \P~\\l M e>J+ irJ J T: (\ Oit th:i:ng ane-tt7t=hem, you know, they respect •,t"'/..A.\ 'r fl 11.. t .!2, i\T' I really encourage young people~ z, to talk to me pretty freely, 3 1e a, tell me things and just talk together. rreally don't see all that much difference bdiv\!fA\. ttl. l.,,_c~a_ my friends ..:?~1'-/J___ I l do l,1/kc\.-, l>/ r-, '\. ,::.i' fv-0-fcvfIt might be a better , all right, you don't know what you want to () ,;::, .. -~ ' ... , . ' ,-, "'. \ \ .. u ) ;.. . I/ .. T: Right. B: 13W ,_, and then when you go into college do you make pretty good grades in school? T: Yes, they're pretty good except for physical science.

PAGE 10

UL lOA Page 10. dib B: That's sort of a man's subject anyway, isn't it? T: Yes .. B: Guys get more interested in T: Right. .Jr •. \ ,_\I• B: physical things •~ girls ------I suppose the girls -•, .. ,.....,~1 beat them in some other areas ) ,r\' .. r 1 \ 2 , r. ,,. ' Do you study Home Ee.? T: Yes. B: Do you find it's a helpful subject? T: Anyway I'd like the course(e,a aha: a:, like sewing and cooking. ~here you got/3/o.aalmw:~ two things you can do. You could work in a factory,~U_a;:.., if !.ou wanted to, making clothes or be a cook or something like that,,ss I \ working in a nice restaurant. B: Is there anything you'd like to pass on to other young people? T: No. B: I want t~r,:.cto thank you so very much for 1.( p.-: r. r1). 0 } ;r !~~-0. T: Thank you. this interview,; B: You're very, you're a nice .Sv-6JC:.ct-'--to interview. Thank you so very much. Jou I r-u T: / -!:fr:rr welcome.