Interview with Carrie B. Lovette, February 10, 1986

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Interview with Carrie B. Lovette, February 10, 1986
Lovette, Carrie B. ( Interviewee )
Samuel Proctor Oral History Program
Publication Date:


Subjects / Keywords:
Fifth Avenue (Gainesville, Fla.)
African Americans ( fast )
Fifth Avenue African American (Alachua County) Oral History Collection
Joel Buchanan Archive of African American Oral History ( local )
Florida History ( local )
Oral histories ( lcgft )
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This text has been transcribed from an audio or video oral history. Digitization was funded by a gift from Caleb J. and Michele B. Grimes.

Record Information

Source Institution:
Samuel Proctor Oral History Program, Department of History, University of Florida
Holding Location:
This interview is part of the 'Fifth Avenue Blacks' collection of interviews held by the Samuel Proctor Oral History Program of the Department of History at the University of Florida
Rights Management:
Made available under a Creative Commons Attribution Non-Commercial 4.0 International license:
Resource Identifier:
FAB 043 Carrie B. Lovette 02-10-1986 ( SPOHP IDENTIFIER )


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Oral History Program

Interviewee: Mrs. Carrie B. Lovette

Interviewer: Joel Buchanan

Febraury 10, 1986



Mrs. Carrie Busch Lovette was born in January 1913, in Jupiter. Florida.
At an early age she moved to St. Augustine. She attended several private
schools for her early education, but she graduated from the high school
department at Florida A & M in 1933. She completed her courses for teacher
certification at Florida Memorial College and later obtained her master's
degree in library science from Syracuse University in New York. Mrs. Lovette
was the librarian at Lincoln High School and also taught classes in social
studies and English occasionally.

This interview discusses Mrs. Lovette's experiences as the librarian at
Lincoln High School and her feelings when Lincoln High School was closed. She
also explains her activities in many social and service organizations in the

B: Mrs. Lovette has been a teacher librarian for more than thirty-six years.
This interview is being conducted in her home. Good morning Mrs.

L: Good morning Mr. Buchanan.

B: How are you this morning?

L: Oh, I am just fine.

B: Mrs. Lovette, will you please tell me what the B is for in your name?

L: The "B" is for Busch.

B: Now is that your family's name?

L: Yes, that is a family name.

B: Tell me something about the Busch family.

L: Well my mother was Sarah Ann Busch and my father's name was Govan Busch
and he died at a very early age.

B: Where was the Busch family from?

L: Originally from Blackville, South Carolina.

B: Did your parents ever explain to you how they got from Carolina to

L: Yes, they moved from Blackville to a little place on the east coast,
Jupiter, Florida. That is where my mother lived until my father passed.
And then she moved to St. Augustine, Florida, where she had a sister,
and, of course, she wanted to be near her because she had to work.

B: And her sister's name was?

L: Mary Elizabeth Busch.

B: So this was your mother's sister or your father's sister.

L: No that is my sister's name. Mary Elizabeth Busch. My mother's name was
Sarah Ann Busch and her sister's name Henrietta Davis.

B: How young was Carrie Busch during the time when your parents were doing
this moving? Were you born in Carolina? Where were you born may I ask?

L: I was born in Florida. Really in Jupiter, Florida, but I remember
nothing about Jupiter, so I always claim St. Augustine, Florida as my

B: Do you mind sharing with us when Mrs. Lovette was born?

L: No, not at all. I was born in January 1913.


B: Tell me something about your childhood in St. Augustine as a young girl
with a sister.

L: Well we were brought up as a very close knit family, and, of course, my
first school was a Catholic school and after we left the Catholic school
we went to a public school for about one year. And then, by this time, I
was living with my aunt and she transferred us to a private school which
was known as Couples Boarding School under the presbyterian doctrine.

B: Now were you at this private school for your duration of your early years
of schooling.

L: No, I left there when Couples school closed down. And they sent me to
North Carolina. Concord, North Carolina to attend Barber-Scotia College
it was known as Barber-Scotia College at the time.

B: Weren't you a very young girl?

L: Yes, I was about, maybe eighth grade when I went there.

B: Well, why did they send you there?

L: Because they did not think much of the public schools at that time. They
were very strick and they wanted us to be, well, I should say good girls.
So they sent us away to a boarding school.

B: This is you and your sister?

L: Yes. My sister went first, and she was there about a year before I went,
and then they sent me.

B: Did you graduate from that school in Carolina?

L: No. After I left Concord, then they brought me back to, my aunt died by
this time, my mother. I went to live with my mother, and my mother was
asked by my aunt to, you know, continue to send us to some sort of
boarding school. So then she sent me to Florida A & M College. It is,
you know it is A & M College, but it was the high school department there
at the time. And of course I was in boarding school you know there.

B: Now, did you graduate from A & M High School?

L: Yes, I finished, I graduated from the A & M High School.

B: This is the twelfth grade?

L: Yes, twelfth grade. That was still a part of A & M College, the
university now.

B: Now, lets digress for a moment. In going to these private schools, were
you required, were there negro private schools.


L: They were all private, yes negro.

B: And did you all have to wear uniforms?

L: Yes. On certain days, you know, we had to dress in uniforms. Say on
Sunday and the same at Florida A & M. We wore white blouses and blue
skirts, black shoes, and it did not matter what color hose you wore.

B: Now, that was a requirement?

L: That was a requirement at Florida A & M, on certain days that was on
Sunday when we went to the auditorium for you know, church services we
wore that. We marched from our building, what was known as Tuckers Hall
and we had to march from Tuckers Hall with the band playing to the
auditorium for our church services.

B: Every Sunday?

L: Every Sunday, and they had a roll call. And if you were found, you know,
missing they would always come looking for you. And then they would
march you into the auditorium after everybody else was seated.

B: Now what was the purposes of these services on Sunday?

L: Well, that was just, you know, something that was required. That you
would go to church services every Sunday. And you had to go, the high
school people and the college had to wear these white blouses and blue

B: Now, what did the young men wear?

L: Well, the men wore, you know, dark trousers and white shirts. They were
all dressed in uniforms.

B: Well, now weren't you a very young girl to be sent to boarding school,
away from home, and I assume that you worked at the school, correct? Did
you have any more responsibilities besides being a student?

L: Yes. We had duties. We had maybe hall duties, or some sort of duty that
you had to do and at Barber-Scotia we worked in the dining room. We had
hall duties there. But, now at Florida A & M, you were not required too
much to have, you know, duties at all because see you would, I do not
know, we just did not have any duties to do.

B: Why was your aunt so persistent in that the two of you attend private
schools over public schools?

L: I do not know, she just had something about public schools that maybe we
were not getting what we should be getting and then she wanted us to be
very good girls, she would say. And she wanted to keep us away from
those girls that were allowed to go out whenever they, you know, wanted
to. We weren't allowed to do that.


B: You lived in a very strick environment.

L: Very strick environment.

B: Now, what year did you finish the Florida A & M High School?

L: That was in 1933.

B: What did Carrie Busch do at that time?

L: Well, after I left Florida A & M, see I was staying with my mother at
that time. I came to St. Augustine and I attended Florida Memorial
College. It was located then in St. Augustine. And, of course, I
finished two years of college there and then I got a degree and I moved
to Alachua County and began teaching.

B: Did you know you were going to college to be a teacher?

L: Yes, that was what I was being trained for, in early childhood education.

B: What gave you that desire to want to be a teacher?

L: I do not know, just from a little girl, I always said that I wanted to be
a teacher. I admired teachers and I wanted to become one.

B: Is there any teacher that you had in your private school years that
stands out in your mind?

L: Not really. There was one at Florida A & M that I admired. One man
teacher, Mr. Reasoner. And also a Mrs. Phillip Foote were the two
teachers that I really admired because they were very, I do not know, they
were very sympathetic and they were very helpful, and I just admired

B: When you came to Alaucha County I assume that was your first job after
getting a degree.

L: Right, I taught with the two year degree, and then I decided that at that
time, you know, there was so many teachers in Alachua County who did not
have but, some of them did not have a two year degree. And of course
when we came it was quite a few from St. Augustine that came here,
because they had their two years of college life. And after working a
while I would go to summer school every summer and I began working on my
other two years and I did earn that by going every summer.

B: Where did you go in the summer to attend school?

L: I went back to Florida Memorial. It was still located in St. Augustine.
So I graduated, don't ask me what year, but I went on and I received my
other two degrees, my other two years, and then after that I worked a
while and then I went home to Syracuse University. Now, I am ahead of my
story. I attended summer school at New York University and I went there


one summer and then I decided that I wanted to get a degree in library
science. And then I was accepted in the library school at Syracuse
University. And that is where I received a masters degree in library
science in 1956.

B: Now, prior to the 1956 year at Syracuse University. What did you teach?

L: I started on the grade level maybe about fourth grade and then I was
moved up to the junior high school and of course I did not have a degree
in library science, but I was made assistant in the library.

B: Now, what school were you working at?

L: That was at Lincoln. We called it the Old Lincoln, but it was Lincoln
High School on Seventh Avenue.

B: Now, were you hired by Professor A. Quinn Jones?

L: I was hired by Professor A. Quinn Jones. And he was the one that
encouraged me to go on to library school and of course I was a great
reader of books and I just enjoyed working in the library, working with

B: Let me ask you something. The years that you helped in the library,
prior to going to Syracuse, what was the library facility like at Lincoln
High School, and I assume that this was what in the mid-1940s?

L: Mid-1940s, well we had shelves, it was a nice room, they took three rooms
and made it into a library. Of course, they had shelving and tables and
chairs, and it would accommodate at one time, maybe fifty or more people
at one time.

B: What about supplies, the books?

L: Well, we always had books given to us by friends, and then you were
allowed to order books at the time. We were given books by the county.

B: You were given books by the county?

L: By the county, by the library.

B: Was library science a part of the students curriculum at that time? Were
they required to take library science courses or was it there as a

L: It, just as a resource. We did not offer library sciences at Lincoln.
But we just had an open library for the students you know in the grades
to come and do research or just to read or to check out books.

B: And this was in the late 1940s.

L: The late 1940s. They always had quite a few books and we were given


quite a few books by friends of the library or we were given so many
dollars to spend for library books at that time.

B: After you went to Syracuse and got your masters degree in library science
what did you do then?

L: I came back, that was all during the summer, I never got out of working.
I did that all during the summer. I went to Syracuse University for six
summers. And I came out with my masters degree.

B: They allowed that kind of study then.

L: Oh yes, because you were not allowed to go through the state school here
all the the schools were segregated and you were given what was it, a
fund, you could apply to go out of the state. So that is why I went to
Syracuse. I was funded by the state.

B: What was the maximum amount that you could have? Did they put a capital
on what you could have or did you just decide where you wanted to go and
they paid for it?

L: No, well you applied and of course, if they went along with that then you
were granted this permission to go to an out of state school.

B: Now, did the state pay for the tuition or pay for your entire living
arrangements and everything while you were studying?

L: No, they just paid a certain amount. You could get a certain amount of
your money back, but you had to save your money in order to go on to

B: Did you ever question why Carrie Busch did not go to a state school, that
she had to leave and go out of state.

L: Well, we knew that it was segregated, and of course, you just did not go
to the white schools, so you had to make arrangements if you wanted a
further education, you had to go to out of state schools.

B: So it was understood then?

L: It was understood, and you just did not question it. We went on to, when
times were different from what it is now. And from the time that you
came along.

B: In the years, your early years of being one of the librarians at Lincoln
High School, there was two you said.

L: Right.


B: Were there ever opportunities for you to use the facilities of the
Gainesville public library or the University of Florida library? Were
you allowed in your early years to use their facilities? Or have
knowledge of what was going on in those facilities?

L: No, we did not. We were not allowed in those, not even in the public
library we were not allowed in there. Of course, in later years when
interregration came along, you were free to go to the state libraries and
to the public libraries. But all before that time we were not allowed to
go to those places.

B: Two questions, in your outlining schools like Archer, Hawthorne,
Williston, Newberry, did those schools have libraries as well?

L: Yes they had small libraries, and of course, maybe they did not have
librarians, that is a person with a degree, but they were acting. You
know, they would go in and work in the library so many hours, and the
library was opened to the children there.

B: Was Lincoln the only library for Negro students here. Was there a public
Negro library?

L: Yes, at one time, yes, there was a library on Second Street opposite the
Center at that time. There was a library and of course that was by the
city. And see there was segratation then, they had the white library and
the Negro library and of course, the children could go there to check out
books, and books were such old ones from the main white library, and they
were sent to the Negro library.

B: What was the name of that library?

L: Carver Library, you don't remember that.

B: No I do not.

L: We had a Carver Library.

B: That was the public library for Negroes?

L: That's right.

B: Who was the librarian there?

L: There was, let's see what was her name. She wasn't really trained as a
librarian, it was just a lady there to check out books and to check the
books in, and of course it was a nice clean place. And the children were
allowed to read, to check out books, and read the papers and look at the
magazines and things like that. I remember her name, her first name was
Bessie, but I can't think of her last name right now. But she was over
the Negro library.


B: Since many of the teachers travelled in the summer to northern parts of
the United States for advanced studies, like you were going to Syracuse
University. Were they encouraged by the two libraries at Lincoln or the
principal that while they were away to be very resourceful to get things
and bring it back to the school and give it to the school? Did that
happen a lot?

L: Oh yes, we were encouraged greatly by Mr. A. Quinn Jones. He knew what
was going to happen on down the road, so he encouraged his teachers to go
ahead and further their education. And that we did. We had a lot of
encouragement from our principal.

B: Was there a need for a library at Lincoln the years that you were there?

L: Oh, yes.

B: Well, tell me why.

L: Definitely so, because there were some children who, you know, you did
not have to encourage them to read and do research. They wanted to know
more and of course they would come in and do research papers and just
read for their own enjoyment.

B: Oh really?

L: Yes, this was done. You know that we have had quite a few important
people to graduate from Lincoln High School, doctors, lawyers, what-not.
And of course, they had to be encouraged by their teachers and their
parents, so there was a definite need for libraries in the school.

B: Well, let's get back to that period. In the books that you had, were
many of these books written about Negroes or were Negroes a part of the
content of many of the books?

L: Oh yes. We had, my being librarians they are known as media specialists,
but during that time we tried to order books to develop the knowledge of
black negroes that there were some important negroes in history. And of
course we had quite a few books on negroes and we had a very good
selection about negroes. And that is how the children, you know, learned
about their history.

B: Tell me something about the book that is totally illegal to have on the
shelves, Little Black Sambo, was that part of the collection there?

L: No, I don't ever remember having Little Black Sambo in our collection, I
don't remember that, now we might have had it, but I don't remember.

B: You don't remember.

L: I do not remember having Little Black Sambo.

B: Well, were there...


L: We had more books like History of Jackie Robinson, you know, in sports
and Althea Gibbson, and books like that, any that, and Booker T.
Washington, books like that.

B: Books are very proment blacks?

L: Yes.

B: Were there a lot of black newspapers and magazines later on than there
are now?

L: During that time yes, we did have black newspapers, I remember one was
the, one out of Jacksonville, I can't think of the name. And then we had
another black paper, but I don't think we had too many black papers. I
can't remember.

B: Tell me something else about after you got the degree from Syracuse, came
back to Lincoln and you were there and you had two librarians, and your,
from that point on to retirement were you always a librarian?

L: From that point on I was still assistant to the librarian at Lincoln High
School and but, I taught one or two classes in social studies and
English, and then after, maybe we changed principals. Then I became a
full time assistant librarian and so I didn't teach any classes at all.
I spent my time there and of course we had to teach library science to
the students there, that is how to use the card catalogue and how to find
different books, you know, on the shelves with the use of the card
catalogue. And by this time we had, we were in the new Lincoln, we are
at new Lincoln now, and at the new Lincoln then we received quite a few
of equipment, such as filmstrips, sixteen mm, the overhead projector, and
different equipment like that. And we would teach the, mostly the boys,
because they were mostly interested in that, how to use the different
equipment. And we would have classes, I was in charge of that, we would
use the different equipment you know, and sometimes we would have, we
had library helpers, and they would go out maybe and show a film or a
filmstrip or show teachers how to use the different equipment.

B: The early years of your library, before Lincoln High School moved from
the Northwest to the Southeast, was there a lot of, a great deal of
community, church support in what you were doing with the library, did
they utilize your services as well? The community or the church?

L: No, it was mostly for the students, the libraries. Then the schools were
for the students there. And I don't know of any, very seldom we would
have anyone coming out of the community to use the library.

B: Now, who was the librarian, the first librarian at Lincoln High School?

L: The first librarian at Lincoln High School was Mrs. Cornelia Jones, as
far back as I can remember. During my time, Mrs. Cornelia Jones. That


is the one that I used to assist and of course we worked together until
we were integrated there at Lincoln High School. The new Lincoln High
School we called it.

B: Tell me what stands out in your mind from the improvement from the time
that you started with the library and the new library at Lincoln High
School. What was the difference in terms of improvement?

L: Oh, after we moved from the Northwest side of Gainesville to the
Southeast, it was just a small space that we had, but when we moved to
the new Lincoln, we had a beautiful library, large and really well
equipped with study rooms, and more tables, more chairs, at least we
could get over 100 maybe 200 people in the new library and they were
really using it. The children there, by this time, had learned to use
the library, and we just had better, we had more space, more windows and
there was, everything was just different. More books, we were allotted
more money to spend. We were always allowed to order out books, and of
course we tried to get a variety. We had quite a few references.

B: Approximately how many volumes, total number of books at some point that
you all had in the library?

L: Oh, we had, now I can't remember the exact number, maybe I should have
done a little research before your coming, but we had a large, not in
numbers, I won't give any numbers. But we did have, well-rounded number
of volumes. And, but I can't really remember the number.

B: In your years of being a librarian, were you ever priveleged to go to the
other counter schools, high schools, to visit their facilities?

L: Oh, yes. We were having by this time, we were having meetings together
all librarians would meet.

B: Now this was before they integrated the schools.

L: Oh, yes, this was before the schools were integrated. We would have
meetings with the other librarians in the city. And we would go from,
some times they would come to Lincoln or we would go over to Gainesville
High, to different schools. We would have meetings together, that is to
compare how the books were being used, how the books were being taken
care of, and just to, just see how well the librarians were running it
all. Keeping up with the times.

B: Now, this could be a very biased questions, but being the librarian at
Lincoln High School, which was the only black school here, correct? And
having the chance to see the other facilities and the other books, the
libraries, how did you feel where your library stood in that group?

L: Well, I think that we were about equal, by this time, because we really
had a beautiful collection of books because we were allowed to order the
books, you know, and you didn't have any difference there in the
catalogues that we used. You could select any books that you wanted.


And you could bring your library up to any library in the city. It was
left to the librarians at that time.

B: Up to you to do. So you are saying that Lincoln High School had a well-
established and equipped library for the facilities and for that time?

L: Oh, yes, it was well equipped. We had the collections were up to any
others, as far as in the county.

B: Now, it is said frequently that negro schools were given the trash or the
raggy books from the other schools. The library didn't have this problem
because you ordered your materials, right?

L: We ordered our materials, they gave us so much money to spend, and we
used every penny of it, we didn't have any left over. We used every
penny of the money that we were given. They never said that we had any
left over. And in some cases we went over. We did. So there was never
any comment about that.

B: And were your entire thirty-six years spent at Lincoln High School?

L: No, I started off at, when I came to the county, this is the only county
that I have worked in, and when I came to the county I went to a little
two-room school in LaCrosse, Florida. Where we had one room was grades
one through three and the other grades four, five, six, seven, eight in
another room, they were large rooms. But we had only two rooms, and I
started there I worked there for about two years, then I was moved over
to Williams Elementary School and those are the only schools that I have
worked since I have been in Alachua County.

B: In the two roomed school, what grade did you have, did you have the first
through third, or fourth through eighth.

L: No, I had fourth and fifth grade.

B: Now did they have more than one teacher in a room?

L: No there were two of us and I was in the back part of the room and the
teacher with sixth, seventh, and eighth grade, because there weren't too
many students, and that is why she had three grades. And she was in the
front part. They were large rooms, but there was no petition. I taught
in the back part of the room, while she was in the front.

B: Did that become a problem?

L: Oh, it was a problem, and that was my first year teaching and sometimes,
if the weather was good, we would go out on the campus. We had a very
large campus. We would go out and the children, the boys and girls would
sit on the grass and sometimes I would join them there because I was
young then, and we would sit on the outside and teach.

B: So you actually had two teachers...


L: We had two teachers in the one room.

B: Now did you all do dual planning together or did you teach your group and
she taught her group?

L: I taught my group and she taught hers.

B: So when a student passed to the higher grade he just moved from the back
of the room to the front of the room?

L: Back of the room to the front of the room, right.

B: Excellent. And then the rest of the years was at Lincoln?

L: Williams when I left LaCrosse. I went to Williams Elementary School and
I taught there for a number of years. And then after I left Williams
Elementary, I went to Lincoln and that is where I stayed until they were

B: And at the time of integration where did you go?

L: I went to the Culture Enrichment Center in the old Post Office where they
have the playhouse or theatre.

B: Hippodrome Theatre.

L: That is where I worked until they closed that down. And that was in the
year of 1971. They closed the Culture Enrichment Center. And at the
Culture Enrichment Center we had materials there for teachers, and they
would bring the children from the different schools in the county and
they would, they had different things that would interest the children
there. And of course there was quite a lot of, a large art collection
there and the teachers would collect, would get books and also you know
check out the art supplies from the Culture Enrichment Center.

B: And when you left there where did you go?

L: I retired. I retired in 1971. And that was the end of my teaching

B: What happened to the negro library, when did that facility phase out?

L: At Lincoln you mean?

B: No the city library.

L: Oh the city library, that is when they integrated the city library, then
there was no longer the Carver Library then. All the books that they had
at Carver, I think went over to the city library.

B: And when Lincoln High School was closed, I guess because of the change in
time, what happened to the library at Lincoln?


L: The books were divided among the schools. It was a fine collection, it
went to the different schools. I think some of the books that the other
schools had not taken might have been put in storage because now they are
using them at Lincoln Middle School. And I do not know if they were able
to store many of those books but quite a few of the other schools went
over and made their selection of books.

B: Now were you, Mrs. Smith, and Mrs. Jones all a part of dispersing of the
books when the library closed?

L: At the time Mrs. Jones was ill, and of course we were closed so quickly
that we really didn't have too much time to do anything much about it,
becuase we were transferred to other schools or other places to work. We
had to take inventory of what we had and of course from that they could
tell whether any of the books had been taken or what not. And we didn't
have anything to do with distributing the books. They went in and the
different librarians went in and selected so many books, but I have not
been back to Lincoln Library since I left. I have not. I have been
invited to come, but I just haven't been back.

B: Why?

L: I don't know I just didn't want to go back, and I have not been back,
although I have been invited to come back. But I have not been back. I
have not since it became a middle school, because you know it stayed
closed for a while and the were, I don't know I think they were
remodeling it at the time or something so. I have never had the urge to
go back, so I didn't go.

B: Well that is really amazing. You said that Lincoln was closed so
quickly, are you saying that you all were not given ample time or were
not aware of this change?

L: Well we were aware that we were going to, we didn't know where we were
going until we were notified. We were notified by letter that you would
be going to [phone rings]....

B: You were telling me what now?

L: We were notified by letters were we would be going. We had no idea where
we were going to be moved until we received these letters. Mr. John
Dukes was the principal at that time, and he sent each teacher a letter
telling where you would be going when integration came about. And that
was the time I received, I think I still have that letter. You will be
going to the Cultural Enrichment Center. And a very nice letter thanking
us for the service that we had given and so forth.

B: Now were you allowed the privelege or were the faculty allowed the
privelege to come together and discuss why they were going some place or
after you got this letter, was the school closed then?

L: Oh yes.


B: It was closed?

L: Oh yes, it was definitely closed, when you got this letter, you had about
a week to get your things, you know, whatever you had your personal
things out and you were given time to do that. But that was effective as
of, when integration came about. You didn't have too much time.

B: You didn't?

L: No, you didn't have too much time. You were around when we had

B: Yes. But I am not aware of what the teachers went through.

L: Well, it was really a sad situation you know, because I guess maybe
something good came out of it, but at the time it was just sad for us to
just pull up and go places we didn't know anything about. Wondering if
we would be accepted. And it was just really sad us negro teachers.

B: Well let me ask you this. Did you all have, as negro teachers and
faculty and the administrators, was there any time that the
superintendent or the someone from the office came and discussed with you
all what was going to take place, how it was going to take place or
prepare you for it?

L: Oh yes, they tried to prepare us for it. They came around and talked
with us and you know and tried to prepare us for it. But at that time
they didn't know where we were going, but they said each teacher would be
placed and that is all that we had. You could not say that maybe I would
like to go to this place.

B: You didn't have a choice?

L: No, you had to go where you were sent. And you didn't know where you
would be sent until, in our situation at Lincoln until you received this
letter saying where you would be going. The librarian Miss Smith went on
to Howard Bishop, she went over to Howard Bishop and I went to the
Cultural Enrichment Center.

B: Now what did they do with all the students from Lincoln High School?

L: Well they went to different schools, different children were assigned to
different schools, you know just like the teachers. They were assigned.
Some went to, did they have Eastside at this time--no they didn't have
Eastside, so most went to Gainesville High. You know, that is where the
high school students went. And the other students went, see they were
integrating the negro children and of course integrating the whites too,
so they were put in so many of the city schools.

B: Well were there ever any white faculty at Lincoln prior to the closing?


L: Oh yes. The faculty was integrated before they closed. The faculty was
integrated before Lincoln closed and we had one or two white students
there too. We had one or two white students who came to Lincoln. Not
many but a few. But we had quite a few white teachers that came over to
Lincoln before we were moved to the integrated schools.

B: What was the first day like for Carrie Busch Lovette when she left
Lincoln and went to the Cultural Enrichment Center? That was a big
difference wasn't it?

L: I would say it was quite a big difference there because when I was moved
to the Cultural Enrichment Center well it was just one librarian or media
specialist at that time. And I took over, it wasn't a large place, just
a small area with a few books on the shelves and so I just went in and I
had to work so I just accepted my situation. But I enjoyed it.
Everybody was very nice, they welcomed me there as the librarian and I
enjoyed my work while I was there.

B: Now what was the Center for? You had the Gainesville Public Library and
was this facility just for the school system to use or was it for the
public to use or what?

L: Well, they was opened to the public and mostly you know to the schools
because as I said they had, well you had equipment there too and then you
had these art picture, collections of art pictures, and what do you call
it the other items art items.

B: Like sculptures and vases?

L: Yes, things like that.

B: That was there.

L: All of that was there. And then it taught the teachers how to use the
different equipment because that's where, it was stored there at the time
the schools were closed a lot of equipment came to the Culture Enrichment
Center. And they had a collection of books on art and things like that
and that mostly for the teachers. And children couldn't really check out
anything but they would come to look at the art collections that they had
and artifacts.

B: After the teachers from Lincoln and I guess your other black schools
received their letter, let's talk about Lincoln. Did you all ever get
back together after the school closed as a group?

L: Oh yes, as a group we got together just had a gathering, you know, we
hadn't seen each other in a good while so we had maybe we would say
social hour and we came back together and talked about our situations and
that was that. But it was nice, you know, to see each other again after
we had to get used to our new places and of course I think the teachers
just accepted the situation well.


B: The teachers accepted the situation more so than the students.

L: Oh yes, because the students put up a fight, you know, when they were
moved. And it was a sad day, the day that they closed Lincoln, they were
trying to really destroy it. I don't know, it was really just a sad day
for the students, they didn't accept it at first. But I think they
really learned in a hurry about the whole situation.

B: Let's just get your personal feeling of that. Could it have been handled
differently and do you think that when they closed Lincoln they closed a
period of history that will never be replinished again?

L: I think it could have been handled maybe just a little different, because
we didn't wait until the end of the school term, we were transferred in
the middle of the school term. It wasn't the end.

B: Oh it wasn't?

L: No it wasn't the end it was almost in the middle that you were just
picked up, they said we are going to integrate and we integrated. And
that was it, we didn't wait until the end of the school year.

B: So there were students that were half way through that were all of the
sudden not there any more.

L: That's right. So that's the way that happened. And that was in what
year was that, it must have been 1968, I think it was in 1968. I am not
too good on remembering dates, but I think it could have been handled
just a little different you know, than it was. When they said we are
going to integrate, they meant that we are going to integrate now.
Because I imagine that was just an order that you integrate or else.

B: And you all integrated?

L: We integrated, we accepted it. That's all we could do.

B: Why couldn't we have closed Gainesville High School?

L: Now that is another thought that came to my mind. Why close because
Lincoln was really just a new school, and why couldn't they have moved
the students over to Lincoln instead of the students going to Gainesville
High. That's what, or to these other schools. But, I don't know they
just, it just didn't happen like that. I think the whites were afraid of
the neighborhood or something. They had been given the wrong ideas about
the negro community. And they were afraid for their children to come
over to Lincoln. To me, I felt like they should have integrated the
school right there at Lincoln.

B: Right they could have done half and half. Why not?

L: Because see Lincoln was a new, it was a more modern....


B: Newer than Gainesville High School?

L: Oh sure, Lincoln was built since Gainesville High I am sure. They have
added on to Gainesville High, but Lincoln was built since Gainesville

B: And from what I have heard you all were larger.

L: Yes, it was larger and everything, but I think it was the parents who
didn't want their children to come over to the black community. But now
that Lincoln is a middle school they are coming from all directions. I
think that they have learned that it is not that bad.

B: Now the black students were being bused into Lincoln? Before they had
integration? Were you busing students?

L: Oh yes, they were bused from surrounding schools or from Hawthorne, and
Rochelle, they were bused in from surrounding areas. Archer and
Micanopy, all those schools they children were bused in.

B: So we have been bused for years.

L: Oh yes, a long time.

B: The boarding schools?

L: Oh, no, they did not know anything about school buses during my time. We
did not have any school buses because at this private school that I
attended in St. Augustine, we were in walking distance. If the weather
was bad we were transported by our uncle to the school. And so, there
was no difficulty there. The children were all in walking distance of
the school.

B: So, busing came later, but black students had been bused for years.

L: The children coming to Lincoln were passing white schools coming to
Lincoln on the bus, see. The black children have been bused so many
years before this integration came in.

B: Now, we have talked about your professional life, let's find out
something about the private life of Carrie Lovette. When did the name
change from Busch to Lovette?

L: Lovette is my second marriage. I was married at one time, my name was
Gibson, most of the young men and women for a long time knew me as
Gibson. Then in later years I became Lovette.

B: What was Mr. Lovette's name?

L: He had an initial name, K. D. Lovette.

B: What did those initials stand for?


L: For nothing, it was just an initial name. The 'K' stood for nothing, the
'D' stood for nothing, it was just an initial name and that was my last

B: Where were the Lovette's from?

L: The Lovette's were from Suwanne County. I do not know too much about his
family. I know his aunt who lived in Newberry, then he had a cousin in
Live Oak and that is about the extent. Of course, I have a step-
daughter, his dauther, Dolores Dixon, who lives ;in Chattanooga,
Tennessee. She was reared in what was a private school to Baldwin Haven
and now she graduated and has her masters in early childhood education.
She married a dentist, Fredick Dixon, from Jacksonville, Florida.

B: Do they have any children?

L: Yes, they have three boys.

B: And so those are your grans?

L: Yes, two boys are in college and the youngest boy is in high school now
in Chattanooga, Tennessee. One is attending Moorehouse and the other boy
is attending Tuskeege Institute.

B: Since Carrie Lovette went to private school, then went to college and got
her bachelors and her masters as a librarian, did you ever encounter
segregation as a young lady living in Gainesville in your shopping or
having to travel. You said you went to New York every summer, did you
ever having any encounters leaving the South going to the North?

L: No encounters at all. I got along just fine. The only thing that
happened here, there was a Wilson Department Store in Gainesville and
most of the teachers had their accounts there. The only thing that we
encountered there at that store, they were nice but when you would go
there to try on hats you had to put paper in the hats before you could
try on the hats.

B: That made the hat bigger didn't it?

L: Oh, yes, you had to put paper in the hats to try them on. They did not
have restrooms for blacks. If they had one, they had colored and white.
In the stores where they had fountains you had colored fountains and
white fountains and you dare not go to drink from a white fountain. For
a long time the teachers traded at Wilsons Department Store, at first
they did not even have a restroom for blacks and it so happened that I am
a member of a club. It is called the Excelcia Matrons, we worked on that
until they built restrooms for blacks.

B: Oh, you mean to tell me that this club dealt with the managers?


L: They dealth with the managers because most of the black teachers were
spending their money there and they just felt that they should have a
place too to go and then later on they built restrooms for blacks.

B: Now, were you all allowed to try on the garments that you were trying to
buy there?

L: Yes, you could try them on. You could try on the garments but they had
tissues, you know. You wiped under your arms well before trying them on
so that there would be no perspiration in the garments. But, we were
allowed to try on the garments.

B: Now, were there separate dressing rooms for you all? Were you allowed to
walk in the front door?

L: OH, yes we were allowed to walk in the front door of Wilsons and any of
the stores you were allowed. But during my time in Gainesville, you know
when you went to these doctor's offices you did not go through the front
door you went in a little side door. They had a little back door that
you could go in and they had a waiting room for blacks and a waiting room
for whites. See, I have been through this segregation bit.

B: You could not walk right through the other. Did you every try, did you
ever think about trying it?

L: You tried but they would tell you now the next time or they would direct
you. If you walked into these white doctors' offices they would rush you
in a hurry to the back and then they would tell you that the next time to
use the entrance to the back. I went to the doctor's office once and I
went through the front door and they asked me to next time come around to
the side, there was a door. And they were nice about it but you were not
supposed to enter there. You dare not let the white patients see you go
in there but you would be referred to these white doctors, I think that
would be the only reason we went. We would be referred to them by our
other doctors.

B: Did you ever have any other problems?

L: No, not really. No problems because I never had to ride the city bus so
I do not know if they had any problems about the riding there in
Gainesville. But we have had, we would not dare to go into the different
restaurants that we go now, nor the theatres, were not allowed. I
remember we had to go from Gainesville to High Springs if we wanted to
see a movie that was showing there and then of course you were segregated
in this movie. But since I have been in Gainesville they did have a
black theatre on Fifth Avenue. You do not remember anything about that
do you?

B: No. So, you mean that you all had to go all the way to High Springs to
see a movie?


L: We had to go to High Springs to see a movie, if we wanted to see it you
know. And then you were segregated because you had to sit up there in
the balcony, but we were allowed to see it. But, we were not allowed to
attend any of the movies here in Gainesville, any of the white movies,
but they did build what was known as the Rose Theatre on Fifth Avenue and
of course that was for all blacks.

B: Did you ever think that you would live during the period where negros and
whites were allowed to share the same schools, be taught by black
teachers, be able to do what you want to do, did you think that you would
get to that? Did you think that you would live to see that point?

L: No, at the time I thought it was just going to be segregated for the rest
of my life. And, of course, since it has been integrated I have learned
to accept it and I enjoy the freedom that we have now in being treated
like human beings. I enjoy that but then we can visit the different
churches, they can visit us, so it is more like people being treated like
they are humans now.

B: Now, was there very much difference in the lifestyles and the conditions
of teaching in Gainesville, Alachua County, and going to Syracuse in the
summer, did you see a big difference in how people were treated in the
South and in the North?

L: Oh, yes you could see that because really they did not show that they had
any biased ideas about you or anything like that. They did not show it
and they were friendlier and you know the schools that are there in New
York and Syracuse they were just friendlier and they showed no animosity.

B: Were there black and white students together in the schools?

L: Oh, yes. When I went to New York University they had always been
integrated as far as I know. There was no difference shown there and we
would have some southerners who would be in there and we were not shown
and difference with the teachers, but there were some students coming
from the South that of course, being used to being integrated, they
showed a lot of, resentment because you were black. Some of them would
not even let you sit beside them. And then when I went to Syracuse it
was altogether different because when I went to Syracuse there were not
too many blacks there, at the time. I think that it was so far away that
too many blacks did not want to go there. But, see they did not offer
library science at Florida A & M, they did not offer library science at
that time. That is why I was given a sum to go to Syracuse University
because whatever they did not offer in the state then you could get the
funds to go elsewhere, and that is why I went to Syracuse.

B: With this masters degree in library science why did you not go and be a
librarian at the University or one of the colleges, Florida A & M or
Florida Memorial?


L: Well, at that time I had my own home and I was married. So I did not
want to give up my home life to apply elsewhere. So, I was perfectly
happy being at home.

B: Now, you mentioned something earlier in a previous statement abou the
organization or club that you belong to, Excelcia Matrons, tell me
something about them?

L: Well, this is a civic organization and Miss Carolyn Green is our
president now, and she is a very fine president. We do more civic work
then anything else. Of course, there is a little social life in it for
us. We contribute to the different organizations like the heart fund
and different organizations like that, helping different black girls and
boys to further their education.

B: Now, you mentioned that this club was instrumental in getting bathrooms
put in at Wilson's Department Store. Have you all been organized for a
very long period of time?

L: Oh, yes we have been organized about forty years, working on different
things that we have found that were not especially appeasing to us, but
we did not go in trying to integrate. We felt that if we patronized
these stores, then we wanted to be treated like customers should.

B: Now this organization, about how many members were in the original group
and how many do you have now?

L: I am a charter member and when we first organized there were only ten of
us. And now it has grown to about twenty.

B: And approximately how many of those twenty are charter members?

L: We have about three.

B: Who are they?

L: Mrs. Altamease Cook, Thelma Jordan, Carrie Lovette because we have had
some to pass. Now those are the original members here in Gainesville,
charter members. Mrs. West passed this year and the others have come in
since then and we have quite a few young people so that they can carry
the club on.

B: Why did you all decide on that name, which is an interesting name? I
assume that you are all ladies.

L: Yes we are all ladies. I do not know why we decided on that name. Mrs.
G. T. (Altamease) Cook and Jenna V. Williams came up with it, I do not
know how, but excelecia means great.

B: Matrons means ladies, so that is it, great ladies.


L: That is it great ladies, so I guess that is how they came up with the

B: And do you all meet on a regular basis, monthly?

L: Yes, we meet once a month. We go to different homes and we meet each

B: Why is it that when you all started you did not meet in some of the
public places? I guess you did not have them then did you?

L: Oh no, we did not have public places. We started meeting in the homes.
But now, sometimes we have our meetings at the Garden Country Club, we
have it at the Holiday Inn or Primrose, you know, different places like
that and we plan to go to Baskens Place, Village Traffic for an affair.
And we want to patronize the black as well as the white so we are
planning on going there soon for an affair that we are planning early
this year.

B: So, you are less than three or four years from your fiftieth anniversary?

L: Right.

B: And are you all planning a grand event for that time?

L: Well, usually we do. We worship, that is in in October, and we go to
different churches. We worship and make a contribution. Then we may go
out to dinner together, so we just plan different activities trying to
keep the club alive.

B: I know that Mrs. Lovette has been a part of a church in Gainesville, what
affiliation is that?

L: I am a member of the African Methodist Episcopal Church and I have been
there for a number of years. I sing in the choir, I have a Sunday School
class and I attend Bible Studies. I am just a part of any activity in
the church. I enjoy being a member in my chruch and working in it. We
have a club that I have been president of for a number of years, and that
is called the ladies auxiliary of the church. The ladies auxiliary
organization was for the beautification of the church. We place ceiling
lights in the church, carpet, and we cushioned the seats in the church
and any other things that we can do for the beautification of the church,
that is what we are there for.

B: You say a number of years, approximately how many years have you been a
member of the church and president of the ladies auxiliary?

L: Well, I was really baptized in the Baptist Church but after I married Mr.
Lovette, he was a staunch Methodist, so we did not want to be divided,
and there was no pressure, but I knew that I would not be able to get him
to come to the Baptist Church. I knew that, there was no question about
it so then I went over to the Methodist Church. I have enjoyed every


year that I have been in it because we are just a working church and a
very spiritual church.

B: Now, why are you not the librarian for the church?

L: Well, I am. There are three of us, Mrs. Wanita Jones, Miss Anne McGee,
and Mrs. Carrie Lovette. We are the three librarians of the church and
we do not have space for such but we take care of the books and
equipment, the little equipment that we have. But one day we plan to
build maybe then we will have a special library room. But, we are the
librarians of the church.

B: Now you retired in 1971, and since 1971 have you been involved in giving
your expertise as a librarian in any way or have you just simply retired
and that has been it?

L: No, I have been working in the community. I have received several awards
and trophies for working with the retired seniors volunteer program. I
received a trophy for twelve years of service working with them and for a
while I kept my little cousins, they are babies, but the mother had
decided that she wanted to stay home. That is why I have this free time
with you today, because I have been working with those children every
since they were born. One is now one, and the other is two and then I
have one that is nine, and I have been helping her with those children so
I have not had too much time. I worked with the Meals on Wheels program
for about eight years and I had to give it up to come and be with the
R.S.V.P., I am working with them still, you know, because it has been
about a month since I did not have to take care of the children and I
started doing work at home. I have been addressing envelopes or stamping
them, or doing research for R.S.V.P., that is looking up addresses,
names, and telephone numbers.

B: So, you are still active?

L: I am still active, I am not just sitting at home. I am active because I
just completed over 800 envelopes for R.S.V.P. aobut two weeks ago. They
keep me busy.

B: Since you were a librarian for more than about thirty-six years and the
library deals with reading, do you find it appealing that when you hear
now that so many students cannot read, especially black students? What
do you think is the reason for that?

L: I think they are not encouraged enough. That is the way I feel. They
are not encouraged enough to read. Now, you can read a book if you want
to, but during our time the teachers required so much reading you were
supposed to read maybe so many books per month. I do not think the
students are required to read as much as they were back then. I think if
they were encouraged at all they could read, but television occupies most
of their time now. So, that is why they are not reading like they
should. But, if the parents would encouage their children to cut off the
television and read more, then I believe they would even read better.


B: As a black librarian in a black school before integration, were those
black boys and girls reading?

L: They were required to read. They were required to read and they were
required to make book reports, to know if they were really reading it.
And we would try to help them. We would encourage the boys and girls to
come to the library and check out books and we would help them. In
dealing with the children, you knew those children that really were
behind or that could not read, and we would try to select books on their
grade level. That is how we helped them. Sometimes the teachers would
let you know that there were children behind in their reading and they
would bring them to the library. During that time they had a slow class
and then a regular class. And they would bring those children to the
library and we would select books. In ordering books you would think
those slow readers, too, and you would order books in order to help them.
Even when I was in the classroom you could readily spot those slow
readers and you would always try to get materials, sometimes you would
have to buy your own materials. We would buy little books for the boys,
the slow readers. You would to to different stores and you would see,
maybe, a beginner's books and what not. And you would buy those books
because we were really interested in the children's learning and we would
help them. And we would get these "easy" reading materials. I have
spent many hours with boys and girls. Sometimes after school I would
spend time with them because they would be slow in a class. And I would
ask them if they really wanted to learn. And I remember at Lincoln one
year, that was when I was teaching, Mr. A. Quinn Jones gave me a room
full of big boys. So, I asked him, I said, "Mr. Jones, why did you give
me those big boys like that?" He said, I was a Gibson at that time, "Miss
Gibson, I just felt like you would be able to help those boys." And you
would be surprised. I could name some of them, but I will not, that I
really helped. I would keep them after school. I would sit in the
seats with them and they would not want the other children to see them
with these easy books. One young man would put it in his notebook. He
would put these easy reading materials in his notebook and close it like
this to keep the other boys from seeing him reading those easy books.
They were interested. They wanted to learn. I would get these easy
books and have them read. I would make word lists for them and tell
them, "Now you learn these words." When you learn these words and the
sound of the letters and what not, and they actually learned to read.

B: So, you feel that the reason that we are having this lack of reading is
because there is not enough encouragement?

L: That is right. They are not making it interesting enough. If they would
just get grade level books to encourage these children to read, I think
we would have more people reading. But, then too, it is not left to the
teachers all together, it is left to the family in the home. I think the
home should encourage the children to read more and turn off the
television sometimes.

B: Is that it, the television?


L: That is it. The television is taking up most of their time. And I think
that is what they need to do. Say now you read and help them. But, you
know, we do not have enough parents taking time out to help their
children, now.

B: Do you feel that integration has had a positive as well as a negative
effect on the black boys and girls?

L: In a way, to my way of thinking, I think that the black teachers were
naturally interested in their children making progress and they helped
them more. But, I do not believe that they are getting the encouragement
that they should have now.

B: You do not think so?

L: I do not think so. I may be a little prejudice, I hope not. But, I just
feel like they need a lot of encouragement.

B: Are you saying that you were able to give more than the pay check was
paying you for when you taught school, and the teachers now-a-days are
just doing what they have to do?

L: That is the way I feel. We were really interested in the children, you
know, getting ahead, and I think we put forth just a little bit more
effort than they are now. I am not putting the teachers down, but some
teachres are just in there for the money. And they do not care if they
learn or not.

B: But you say you had a little more care.

L: I believe we had a little more love to give the children, more care, and
we were really interested. I am sure I was. I was interested in the
children. And if you would talk with some of the boys and girls that I
taught they will tell you Mrs. Lovette made us get such and such a thing.

B: Well, I will never forget the book report I did on the Grapes of Wrath.
You helped me with that immensely in seventh grade. I reinforce what you
are saying. I understand that very much. If you had to do it all over
again, would you be a teacher today? A librarian today?

L: Well, maybe I would be a librarian, but I do not think that I would want
to go in the classroom again because the boys and girls have changed so
much since my time. They have really changed. They do not have the
respect that the boys and girls had when you were in school. They do not
have that respect and I do not think I would be able to really take it.
Because when I first started off I did not have any trouble with
discipline in my classroom. I did not have any trouble. With the
principals that I have taught with, Mr. Jones, Mr. Nealy, Mr. John
Duckes, and, of course, Mr. Rawls was in there as assistant principal.
They would tell you that they never had any trouble with my boys and
girls that I taught. I did not send them to the office for little
frivolous things. I could handle the boys and girls in my room. And it


was not that I was mean, but I just had a communication between my boys
and girls. And I never did, it had to be mighty bad for me to have to
send someone to the office. But, I did not have that trouble. I trying
to control the class because I kept them busy. I tried to make it
interesting. And you just did not have time for problems. You had some
problems because children will be children regardless. It is just the
way you handled the children. I am not saying that I was perfect, but I
tried to make it interesting enough so that they did not have enough time
on their hands for a lot of foolishness.

B: Were children different when you started teaching than in our day? Was
there more of a need or a desire to want to learn than in latter years?

L: I agree there. There was more of a desire. They wanted to learn. As I
told you before, in getting easy material for these big boys that I had,
they wanted to learn. So much so that they would hide it from the other
boys. You know, they did not want them to see them with an easy book, a
first grade book, and they were in eighth grade.

B: Oh, that did happen. So, you are saying to me that you were able to make
it on their level?

L: On their level. See, you had to get materials on a different level. Now
they have a way to testing children to find out what grade level they
are on, but we could tell. You did not have as much testing during that
time, but in working with children, you knew whether they were reading on
their grade level or not. And then you would try to find something that
you thought would be of interest to them.

B: The years you were librarian, you had to have collected a lot of books
and pamphlets and so forth. Do you still have those things as a part of
your storage or keeping?

L: Oh yes, maybe I will show you some of my collections before you go.

B: I would love to see them.

L: I have quite a few books, I have not read them all. But, I have
collected quite a few. I used to be a member of a book club and I have
collected quite a few books. You can just tell that when you look in my
study room that I am interested in reading. In my bedroom I have a shelf
of books and in the den you see books. So I have quite a few books. And
this little cousin of mine, I am able to even help her. She is just in
fourth grade, but I keep up. I have the World Encyclopedias in there and
when she has an assignment to do she will ask for different volumes to
help her, or she will call me to help her with this or that. So, I am
still reminded that I was once a librarian.

B: Well, let me ask you one other professional question before we end this
interview today. Do you feel that library science should be taught as a
part of the curriculum in high school or in college?


L: I do believe that it should be a part of the curriculum. Because even
after you leave high school and you go to college, I think a student
should be aware of how to locate books on the shelves and the different
reference books that they should use. So, I think it definitely should
be a part of the high school curriculum if they plan to go on to college.
They would not know where to start when they go to the library. They
would not know about the card catalog. But now, since I have retired I
know that they have computers. You just go in and punch that and it will
tell you about a book or something. They are getting that in the schools

B: Right. But you still have to know how to use the Dewey Decimal system or
Library of Congress system.

L: That is right. And especially the card catalog. You can go to the card
catalog because they do not have these computers in all of the schools.

Oh, I forgot to tell you, I also had some study with the University of
Chicago, Illinois. These are the different universities that I have
attended: Florida Memorial, which is located now in Miami, New York
University, Syracuse University, and the University of Chicago. I took a
correspondence course from the University of Chicago relating to books
that I needed. So, I took that from the Chicago University then.

B: Are you still able to sit down and create a library right now for private
purposes if it was brought to your attention? Let us say that the church
says, "We want to get together and put together a library to be used for
all the black churches in Gainesville and we have all these materials.
We need your expertise." Can you do that or would you be able to do it?

L: Oh, I am sure with the help of the other librarians. We would need help
because ;I have some that are retired since I have retired. Mrs. Juanita
Jones, maybe she knows something that I did not learn while being a
librarian. There is Ann McGee who was a librarian. And with the three
of us, I am sure that we would be able to put together a library.
Because we all have different levels of expertise, we would be able to
maybe get together and put it together. I notice over at Mount Carmel,
they had a nice library started there. And Mrs. Jones is a member of
Mount Carmel and Miss Juanita Coleman, see they are still putting their
training into action because they have, I think there is another
librarian over there, too. And they have started a nice little library
there. And you can tell that they have been trained to do this work.

B: We have one in our church, too. One of the members of my church is a
librarian at Santa Fe Junior College and she has started one there. Any
books we get we just simply go there and she gives it to us, Sherry

L: Oh, yes, she used to be a member of our church, too.


B: Right. She is there and doing the library which is very delightful.
Would you encourage a young person to go into library science as a

L: Oh, yes. I would definitely encourage them to go into it. It is really
a worthwhile career and I really would encourage them to go into it. All
boys and girls, even young men are going in as librarians, so I would
encourage that, because they cannot all be teachers. All cannot be
lawyers, doctors, and what not, and I think it is just a wonderful career
to be in.

B: Now, we have talked several hours this morning and you have shared with
me your life and about your profession. If there was a statement that
you could leave to young people about education and being fulfilled,
what would Carrie Busch Lovette want to tell a person that was coming

L: Oh, I would tell them to really make the best of their youth, get as much
as they can out of learning. And do not just go to school to make a
passing grade, but put their best into everything and learn something
that they feel like they would be satisfied with and fulfilled. And I
would encourage them to study and not to just study for a passing grade,
but study for themselves, something that will stay with them. I think if
they would just do that, and I would encourage them to make the best of
their school years.

B: There is a lot of statements about blacks, negros being secondary
students and they are not able to compete equally and that we have had an
inferior education. As a librarian working in a black school, do you
feel that you gave quality and that which you were doing was equal to
what was being received by the counterparts.

L: I do believe that. I believe that they were given the same opportunity
as all other boys and girls. And it was left to them to take advantage
of it. The boys and girls should be encouraged now to read more, spend
their time doing something constructive, and I think they would be better
students. Up to number one, whatever.

B: I have enjoyed talking to you today, Mrs. Lovette.

L: Well, thank you.

B: Thank you very kindly. This ends the interview with Mrs. Carrie B.
Lovette, February 10, 1985, in her home 1424 S.E. Second Avenue.