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Title: Saint Vincent government gazette
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Permanent Link: http://ufdc.ufl.edu/UF00077473/00575
 Material Information
Title: Saint Vincent government gazette
Alternate Title: Government gazette
St. Vincent government gazette
Physical Description: v. : ; 35 cm.
Language: English
Creator: Saint Vincent
Publisher: G.P.O.
Place of Publication: Kingstown, St. Vincent
Kingstown St. Vincent
Publication Date: July 11, 1961
Frequency: weekly
regular
 Subjects
Subject: Gazettes -- Periodicals -- Saint Vincent   ( lcsh )
Genre: federal government publication   ( marcgt )
legislation   ( marcgt )
periodical   ( marcgt )
Spatial Coverage: Saint Vincent and the Grenadines -- Saint Vincent
 Notes
Dates or Sequential Designation: v. 1, no. 1 (1868)-v. 112, no. 48 (Tues., 23 Oct. 1979)
General Note: Description based on: Vol. 111, no. 1 (Tues., 3 Jan. 1978); title from caption.
General Note: Supplements which accompany some numbers contain extraordinary issues, ordinances, statutory rules of order, etc.
 Record Information
Bibliographic ID: UF00077473
Volume ID: VID00575
Source Institution: University of Florida
Holding Location: University of Florida
Rights Management: All rights reserved by the source institution and holding location.
Resource Identifier: oclc - 19844741
lccn - sn 89018505
 Related Items
Succeeded by: Government gazette

Table of Contents
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    Statutory Rules and Orders No. 12: Proclamation bringing into operation the Government Housing Loans (Amendment) Ordinance, 1961, on the 11th day of July, 1961
        Page A-23
        Page A-24
    Supplement to Gazette: The Statements of Assets and Liabilities of the Colony of St. Vincent as at 31st August, 1960, and 30th September, 1960
        Page B-1
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    Supplement to Gazette: Legislative Council Proceedings and Debates (Hansard) in the First Session (1957-1958) held on 10th February, 1958, 6th March, 1958. 3rd April, 1958, and 8th May, 1958
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Full Text

























SAINT VINCENT


GOVERNMENT GAZETTE


Vo ] blihV T, JiU 1 1. [o. 36.


VOL. 94,] SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, II JULY, 1961. [No. 36.
--- ... .. ....... , '- r. - --- l ..... .r-., , ,,


GOVERNMENT NOTICES.

No. 216.
APPOINTMENTS.

MARRIAGE OFFICER.

The following person has been ap-
pointed a Marriage Officer with effect
from 6th April, 1961:-
The Reverend ARTHUR HOSKINS
HUGGINs.
11th July, 1961.
(180).


No. 217.


OFFICIAL ATTESTOR.


The undermentioned person has been
appointed as an Official Attestor with
effect from 1st July, 1961 and during
the absence of Mr. T. V. YOUNG, Social
Welfare and Probation Officer. on vaca-
tion leave:-
C. C. SAMUEL, Esq., Acting Social
Welfare and Probation Officer.
11th July, 1961.
(170).

No. 218.
His Honour the Administrator has
been pleased to approve the appoint-
ment of Mr. PETEB DEROCHiE to the


post of Assistant Draughtsman, Public
Works Department, on one year's pro-
bation with effect from 1st July, 1961.
11th July, 1961.
(P.F. 1096).

No. 219.
His Honour the Administrator has
been pleased to approve the appoint-
ment of Mr. MAURICE BROWNE to the
post of Maintenance Officer (Electrical
Installations), Public Works Depart-
ment, on one year's probation with
effect from 6th July, 1961.
11th July, 1961.
(P.F. 1230).

No. 220.
His Honour the Administrator has
been pleas-d to approve the appoint-
ment of Mr. J. H. BAYLISS FREDERICK
as Legal Assistant, St. Vincent, with
effect from 7th July, 1961.
11th July, 1961.
(P.P. 1231).
No. 221.
BEQUIA DISTRICT COUNsCL.

With reference to Gazette Notice
dated 16th January 1961, it is hereby
notified for general information that Mr.
SYDNEY MCINTOSH has been elected
Chairman of the Bequia District Coun-
cil for the life of the present Council
which expires on 31st December, 1961,


E.Q '7 q g














208 SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 11 JULY, 1961.-(No. 36).


vice Hon. C. L. TANNIs, who resigned
with effect from 1st April, 1961.
11th July, 1961.
(S.S. 253).

No. 222.
Consequent on the resignation c
Hon. C. L. TANNIS from the Bequia Dis-
trict Council, His Honour the Adminis-
trator has been pleased to appoint Mr.
FLORIS SIMMONS as a nominated mem-
ber of the Bequia District C6oncil with.
effect from 1st April, 1961, and for the
life of the present Council which ex-
pires in December 1961, in accordance
with the provisions of the Local Gov-
ernment Ordinance No. 17 of 1951.
11th July, 1961.
(S.S. 455).

No. 223.
ACTING APPOINTMENT.

MARKETING BOARD.

With reference to Gazette Notice No.
118 of 18th April, 1961, the Superin-
tendent of Agriculture to act as Chair-
man of the Marketing Board for a
further period of three months with
effect from 1st June, 1961.
11th July, 1961.
(T.P. 84).
No. 224.
VACANT POSTS.

BRITISH HONDURAS.
VACANCIES FOR SCIENCE TEACHERS,
BELIZE TECHNICAL COLLEGE.

Applications are invited for the fol-
lowing vacant posts with the Govern-
ment of British Honduras:
(1) TEACHER (SCIENCE) -
Physics and Mathematics
(2) TEACHER (SCIENCE) -
Chemistry and Biology (or
Chemistry, Botany and Zo-
ology).
Qualifications:-
Applicants should have a University
Degree in the required subjects, and
teaching experience or experience in
industry.
Age Limits--
Preference will be given to applicants
between the ages of 24 and 40.
Duties:-
The duties of the posts are:
(a) to teach the required subjects
at the Belize Technical College,
up to the Advanced Level of


the General Certificate of Edu.
cation set by the Associated
Examining Board.
(b) to be responsible for the equip-
ment in the laboratories.
Salary:-
The appointments will be on contract
for two years in the first instance. The
salary is: $3120 X $120-$3240 X $150
-$4140 E.B. $4290 X $150-$4740
($ B.H. $4.00=1). The Entry point
on the salary scale will depend upon the
qualifications and experience of the suc-
cessful applicants.
Quarters:-
Government quarters will be provid-
ed, if available and rent will be charged
at the rate of 7%% of salary per
annum, subject to a maximum yearly
rent of $480 (120). Basic heavy furni-
ture will be provided at an additional
charge of 6% per annum of its value.
Passages.-
Free passages between the place of
recruitment and British Honduras will
be provided for the officer, his wife and
children, up to a total of five adult
passages, on first appointment, and be-
tween British Honduras and the place
of domicile on final termination of en-
gagement. The children must however,
be below the age of 18, unmarried and
dependent on the officer.
Leave:-
On satisfactory completion of the
officer's engagement, he will be eligible
for vacation leave at the rate of five
days for each completed month of resi-
dent service subject to a maximum of
180 days. The officer will also be eli-
gible for local leave at the rate of 16
days per annum.
Medical Treatment:-
Free medical attention is provided for
the officer at Government hospitals. If
he is admitted to a hospital he will be
charged for maintenance at the rate of
$2.00 (10/-) a day. His family may be
treated as out patients at any Govern-
ment hospital at a cost of $1.50 (7/6d)
for each professional attendance in addi-
tion to the cost of medicines supplied.
Applications, which should be accom-
panied by three recent testimonial;,
should be addressed to the Secretary,
Public Service Commission, Public
Building, Belize, British Honduras, and
should reach him not later than the
28th of July, 1961.
On satisfactory completion of the con-
tract a gratuity of 12%1/ of salary is
payable.
11th July, 1961.













SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 11 JULY, 1961.-(No. 36).


No. 225.
MISCELLANEOUS NOTICES.
ROYAL SOCIETY OF BRITISH
SCUPLTORS.

The Sir Otto Beit Medal for Sculpture.

The Royal Society of British Sculp-
tors wish to bring to the attention of
sculptors working in the British Isles
and Commonwealth the following
information.
From the fund provided by Sir Otto
Beit for the provision of the "Annual
best work of the year Medal" which
may be awarded only to works
exhibited to the public in London, the
Council have been authorised to award
a second medal to be known as the "Sir
Otto Beit medal for Sculpture" for
works exhibited to the public elsewhere
in the British Isles and Commonwealth.
By the terms of the bequest only
sculptors who are British subjects are
eligible for this award.
Nominations for this award giving
particulars of the sculptor, together
with photographs, details and dimen-
sions of the work Goncerned, should be
sent to the Secretary, Royal Society of
British Sculptors, 6 Queen Square,
London, W.C. 1. Photographs etc.
should reach the office not later than
October 25th.
The decision of the Council is final.

Rules.
1. The sculptor must be a citizen
of the British Commonwealth.
2. The method of entry shall be by
photographs only and in no case may
the work itself be submitted. An
accompanying letter must give full
details of the work and every photo-
graph submitted must bear the name
and address of the sculptor and the
ini:._zl,, dimensions and date of first
exhibition of the work.
3. The sculpturee must have been
first publicly exhibited any time be-
tween the first day of November of
the year previous to the named year
of entry and the twenty-fifth day of
October of the year of entry, in any
part of the Commonwealth outside
London (the administrative county of
London). (To be interpreted as hav-
ing been shown in an exhibition open
to the public or placed on or in a
building to which the public i3
admitted.
4. Up to three works by a sculptor
may be entered if they conform to the
rules in other ways.


5. A work can be entered by the
sculptor himself or by any other
person, or group of persons, provided
the consent of the sculptor has first been
obtained.
6. In the case of sculptors not mem-
bers of the Royal Society of British
Sculptors and where the entry is made
by the sculptor himself, it should be
accompanied by a letter from a respon-
sible person declaring that, to the bel.
of his information, the entry conforims
with these rules.
7. Works must be in a reasonably
durable material, at least cast in
plaster of Paris:
8. The Council of the Royal Society
of British Sculptors doe3 not bind
itself to award the medal in any one
year if, in its opinion no entry reaches
a sufficiently high standard, but the
Council will not unreasonably with-
hold the award.
9. The decision of the Council :l1
all matters is final.
All communications should be a:l-
dressed to:-
The Secretary, Royal Society of
British Sculptors,
6, Queen Square, London, W.C. 1.
llth July, 1961.
(S.S. 282).

No. 213.
OXFORD UNIVERSITY COM-
MITTEE FOR COMMONWEALTH
STUDIES

PREPARATORY COURSE IN TROPICAL
AGRICULTURE--3rd--15th July, 1961.

The Course is primarily designed to
help those who are proceeding to the
tropics for the first time to take up
agricultural posts. Most such people
will already have some training in gen-
eral agricultural science; but inquiries
from people without this qualification
will also be welcomed, if they think they
will benefit from the course. TIhe
course should prove useful to newly-an-
pointed staff of governments, missionary
societies, business firms and others.
Topics on the course will include:
tropical climates and soils, soil conserva-
tion, tropical crops and livestock, the
economics of tropical agriculture and
agricultural extension work. The method
of study will be by lectures, demonstra-
tions, discussion groups, reading (ior
which excellent library facilities are
available), and written work if desired.
Participants in the course will have to
pay nothing except the expenses of their
accommodation in Oxford. Accom-
modation for a limited number can be


_ _~_~_ __













210 SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 11 JULY, 1961-(No. 36).


offered at the Commonwealth Services DEPARTMENTAL AND
Club, 3, South Parks Road.
If the demand for this initial course OTHER NOTICES.
justifies it, similar courses (for which
fees.will be charged) will be run in sub- EDUCATION NOTICES.
sequent years.
All enquiries should be addressed in)
Mr. G. B. Masefield, Department of Offers df Edifeational Facilities by
Agriculture, Parks Road, Oxford. Member States of the United- Nations.
4th July, 1961.
4th July, 1961. Information has been received by
No. 214. the Secretary-General of the United
W T N TTTNations that the Government of Vene-
WEST INDIES CONSTITUTIONAL zuela has renewed its previous offer
CONFERENCE, 1961. of three five-year scholarships under
General Assembly resolution 845 (IX)
The Report on the West Indies Con- to secondary graduates from Non-Self-
stitutional Conference held in London Governing Territories for the study of
in May and June, 1961 has been received Petroleum Engineering at the Univer-
and may be seen on application at 0ov- sity of Zhlia for the academic yepR.
ernment Office. 1961/62.
Copies are available for sale at a In addition the Government of Vene-
cost of 480 each. zuela has offered four bcholarships to
4th July, 1961. graduate physicians, engineers and
(C. 599.) other public health staff with uniVer-
.' sity degrees from Non-Self-Governing
No. 226. Territories for its forthcoming Nine-
LEGISLATION. teenth International Course in Malaria
Sand Related Diseases which will be
The following Document is published under the auspices of the Division of
with this issue of the Gazette. Malariology, Ministry of Public Health
and Social Assistance at Maracay,
S.R. & O. No. 12.-Proclamation Aragua. The course begins on 15th
bringing into operation the Gov- January, 1962, and will last for
ernment Housing Loans (Amend- approximately five month-.
ment) Ordinance, 1961, cn thr The scholarship3 v.ill include the
11th day of July, 1961. round trip fare and a fortnightly
11th July, 1961. stipend of 500 bolivares (USA
(A. 42/1944 III). $149.25).
Candidates -hould preferably be less
No. 227. tliha 35 year. old and should have
SUPPLEMENTS TO GAZETTE. : g .i cornuand of the Spanish
language.
The Statemrnits of Assets and Liabili- Applications for the Petroleum En-
ties of the Colony of St. Vincent as at gineering Scholarships which commen-
31st August, 1960. and 30th September. ces in October, 1961, should be sub-
1960. are published with this issue of emitted through the Secretary-General
the Gazette. of the United Nations by 1st Septem-
11th July, 191. ber, 1961, and those for the course in
SMalaria by 1st November, 1961.
No. 228. Applicants are requested to supply
es o the Le islative Cnc detailed information regarding their
Copies of the Legislative Council qualifications and experience in their
Proceedings and Debates (Hansard) letter of application accompanied by
in the First ,ession (1957--1958) held supporting documents to reach the
on 58h February, 1958, 6th March, Education Officer, Kingstown, St Vin-
1958. 3rd April 19, and 8th May, cent not later than 31st July, 1961.
1958, which may be seen at Governmentot later than 31st 196
Office, the Kingstown Library, and at all 27th June, 1961.
Revenue Offices, are published with this
issue of the Gazette.
OFFERS OF EDUCATIONAL FACILITIES
By Command, bv MEMBER STATES OF THE
UNITED NATIONS.
E. A. BRATHWAITE,
Chief Hecretary.
CeEf SecreFary.E Information hao- been received by the
GOVERNMET OFFICE, Secretary-General of the United Nations
11th July, 1961. that:-













SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 11 JULY, 1961.-(No. 36). 211


1. The Government of Ceylon has Mlr. Hayley, the Financial Secretary of
pursue secondary education, one that Territory. This appointment takes
scholarships to students from non- 'effect from 1st June, 1961.
self-governing territories, one to,
renewed its previous offer of three L. SPENCE,
to study draughting and another Executive Commissioner
one to study surveying and level- British Caribbean
ling in Ceylon. The latter two Currency Board.
scholarships are for Secondary Headquarters,
School graduates and are of one
year's duration. The secondary Board of Commissioners of
education scholarship is for stu- Currency,
dents holding the Jr. Cambridge British Caribbean Territories
School certificate and is of four (Eastern Group)
year's duration. Trinidad.
2. The Government of Turkey has 21st June, 1961.
renewed its previous offer of five
scholarships to students from
Trust and non-self-governing ter- SAINT VINCENT.
ritories for technical and voca-
tional training for the academic By Authority of the Registration of
year 1962-63. The Permanent United Kingdom Patents Ordin-
Representative of Turkey requests ance (chapter 156 of the Revised
that applications for these scholar- Laws of St. Vincent, 1926).
ships should be filed after 31st
October, 1961. Gazetted 11th July, 1961.


Applicants are requested to supply
detailed information regarding their
qualifications and experience in their
letter of application and this should be
accompanied by supporting documents
to reach the Education Officer, Kings-
town, St. Vincent, not later than 31st
July, 1961.

JEMMOTT J. ANTROBUS,
Acting Education Oficer.

Education Department,
Kingstown,
22nd June, 1961.


BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS OF
CURRENCY, BRITISH CARIBBEAN
TERRITORIES (EASTERN GROUP).

(Article 1 (i) of the Currency Agree-
ment.)
The Secretary of State for the Colo-
nies has, on the nomination of the
Administrators of Antigua, St. Kitts-
Nevis-Anguilla and Montserrat, appoint-
ed the Financial Secretary of St. Kitts-
Nevis-Anguilla to be a Commissioner
representing those Territories, compris-
ing the Leeward Islands, on the Board
of Commissioners of Currency, British
Caribbean Territories (Eastern Group).
The Secretary of State for the Colo-
nies, on the nomination of the Adminis-
trators of the Territories named above,
has also appointed the Financial Secre-
tary of Antigua to act as a Commis-
sioner during the absence from the
Territory of St. Kitts-Nevis-Anguilla of


NOTICE is hereby given that an
application was on the 19th day of June,
1961, made by Corn Products Company,
a corporation organised and existing
under the laws of the State of Dela-
ware, United States of America, of 717
Fifth Avenue, City of.New York, Sta.e
of New York, United States of America,
for a patent entitled Starch Manufac-
turing process.
Any person may at any time within
two months from the date of publica-
tion of this notice in the Gazette, give
notice to the Registrar of opposition to
the issue of a certificate of registration
upon any of the grounds prescribed by
section 27 of the Patents Ordinance
(chapter 155) for opposition to the
grant of Letters Patent.
H. M. SQUIRES,
Registrar of Patents.
Patent Office,
St. Vincent,
4th July, 1961.


POLICE NOTICES.

New Park Stand-Parking of Private
Oars.

The New Park Stand adjoining the
Court Yard will be available for park-
ing with effect from Monday 10th July,
1961.
This Park Stand is for Private Cars
ONLY. BusPs. Trucks and H. Cars are
strictly prohibited.













212 SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 11 JULY, 1961.-(No. 36).


The Park Stand at White Chapel
Road opposite the New Park Stand is
also available for Private Cars.
S. A. ANDERSON,
Chief of Police.
6th July, 1961.


No Parking Between Signs-
Middle Street.

With effect from Monday 10th July,
1961 parking is strictly prohibited in
Middle Street from the Corner of South
River Road to Hillsboro Street between
the hours of 8.00 a.m.-4.00 p.m.
S. A. ANDERSON,
Chief of Police.
6th July, 1961.

STOP SIGNS.

It is promulgated for the information
of all concerned that Stop signs, White
lines and Cats' eye were recently erected
and placed at the following points:-
1. Corner of Old Montrose and Lodge
Village Roads.
2. Corner of Lodge Village Road
and the unnamed Road leading
from Kingstown Park.
3. Corner of Kingstown Park Road
and Mrs. Jennings' Corner-West.
4. Corner of Kingstown Park Road
and Mrs. Jennings' Corner-East.
5. Corner of Kingstown Hill and
Murray Road.
6. Corner of Grammar School Road
and Murray Road-near Agricul-
ture Deparment.
7. Corner of Kingstown Hill and
Sion Hill.
8. Corner of McKies Hill and Murray
Road.
9. Corner of Arnos Vale road and
road leading from P.W.D.-Arnos
Vale.

S. A. ANDERSON,
Chief of Police.
6th July, 1961.- :


OusToMs, irt .icK

ADVERTISING MATTER AND COMMERCIAL
SAMPLES:

The attention of Merchants and Im-
porters is drawn to the subject of the
treatment of Commercial samples and
Advertising matter.


Advertising matter of no commercial
value, and patterns and samples of negli-
gible value, are exempted from duty in
the St. Vincent Customs Tariff, items
13 and 30 of Table B.
There has, however, always existed
some doubt among Importers as to how
advertising matter and samples on the
whole should be dealt with, and the fol-
lowing paragraph is an attempt to
clarify further Customs interpretation
and method of treatment.
Bona fide samples of no intrinsic value
and advertising matter which can be
used only to advertise products, are ad-
missible free of duty. If, however,
samples do have some commercial value
or use, they should be treated as dutiable
goods. Similarly, advertising matter
which, though used to advertise products
or manufacturing firms and the like, is
of use, and which if allowed in duty
free would tend to compete with the
ordinary "Commercial" commodity,
should bear duty. In cases where no
value is stated for Customs purposes,
this would be assessed by the Collector
of Customs.
JAMES H. D. COX,
Collector of Customs and Excise.
28th June, 1961.

SAINT VINCENT.
IN THE SUPREME COURT OF THE
WINDWARD ISLANDS AND
LEEWARD ISLANDS.
A.D. 1960.


SUIT No. 91
BETWEEN
ALLAN HUGGINs


Plaintiff


and
THE ST. LUCIA INSURANCE
COxPANY LTD. Defendant

Notice is hereby given that on Satur-
day, 5th August, 1961, between the
hours of 12 o'clock noon and 3.00 p.m.
there will be put up for sale at the
Court House in Kingstown the under-
mentioned goods and chattels the pro-
perty of the above named defendant The
St. Lucia Insurance Company Ltd.
levied upon by virtue of a writ of seizure
and sale issued in the above suit:
One typewriter, (Hermes Baby)
Four writing desks
Nine sitting chairs
One alarm clock.
Dated this 8th day of July, 1961.
D. A. NILES,
Deputy Registrar,
S- Supreme Court.














SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 11 JULY, 1961.-(No. 36). 212
. . I l -. 111 1 I


ST. VINCENT.
IN THE KINGSTOWN MAGIS-
TRATE'S COURT FIRST DISTRICT
CIVIL JURISDICTION
A.D. 1961.

SUIT No. 117/61
BETWEEN:
JONATHAN BABB of Kingstown
Plaintiff
and
1EZEKIAH EUSTACE of Kingstown
Defendant

The undermentioned goods and chat-
tel, property of the above named defend-


ant, levied upon by virtue of a Writ of
Seizure and Sale issued in the above
suit, will be put up for sale by Public
Auction at the Court House, Kingstown,
on Saturday the 22nd day of July, 1961
at 1 p.m.
That is
Four (4) Wooden Dining Tables

Dated this 5th day of July, 1961.

L. G. E. K. LEWIS,
Magistrate.
Chambers,
Court House,
Kingstown.


PWInTD BY TEE GOVERNmENT PRINTER AT THE GOVERNMENT= iRINTINL OFFICE,
ZKNGSTOWN, ST. VINCENT.
[Price-30 cents.]











SAINT VINCENT. S '

STATUTORY RULES AND ORDERS,

1961, No. 12.


(Gazetted 11th July, 1961).


BY THE ADMINISTRATOR

A PROCLAMATION.

[L.S.]
A. F. GILES,
Administrator.
WHEREA it is enacted by section 5 of the Government Housing Loans
(Amendment) Ordinance, 1961, that the said Ordinance shall come into opera-
tion on a date to be appointed by the Administrator by Proclamation published
in the Gazette:
Now THEmREFRE I, ALEXANDER FALCONER GILES, the Officer for the time
being administering the Government of the Colony of Saint Vincent, pursuant
to the authority in me vested by the said Ordinance do hereby proclaim that the
aforesaid Ordinance shall come into operation on the 11th day of July,' 1961.
GIVEN under my hand and the Public Seal of the Colony of Saint Vincent
at Government Office in the said Colony this Eighth day of July, One
thousand nine hundred and sixty-one and in the Tenth Year of the
Reign of Her Majesty QUEEN ELIZABETH THE SECOND.

GOD SAVE THE QUEEN!
(A. 42/1944 III).


PRINTED BY THE GOVERNMENT PRINTER AT THE GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE,
KINGSTOWN, ST. VINCENT.
[ Price 4 cents. 1

7 1961.



/7 i sys







Statement of Assets and Liabilities of the Colony of St. Vincent as at 31st August 1960.


1959
$ c.

1,693,180.00 D:POSITS:-

Special Funils

Other than Special Fun.ls

998,400.00 OVERDRAFTS:-

C. A. Joint Consolidated Fnid .





:35,322.00 Colony Reserve Fund


S c. ( C c.



... 2,007,183.00

... 149,195.00 ?.5i ..37.0



.50:.800.00





'-i 5,:!22..


1959
$ e.

1,217.852.001 i ADVANCKS:-

Persoiail

Oti0 1.1


289,678.00














80Er54.91


414,830.CO




2,2.9(2.00 2.700,500.00 2,726.902.00


CASH :-

Barclays lank

Cronii Agents C'nrrint

Drafts aIn Ritemitlances

Iimpes's

'I'reasnury ;ind Subl-Accountants




In vcsinments

GENERAL REVENUE BALANCE:-
Surplus and Deficit

LESS :-Balance as at 1. 1. 60


.272,634.00

...1,137,591.00



... 86,331.00

... 2,311.00

3.744.00

... 17,565.00

... 25.618.00
II


1,410,225.00











135,569.00


I


I


NOTES:-1. At 31t August, 1960, the Public Debt of the Colony (not recorded in the above Liabilities) stood at $485.025.00 and the accumulated Funds for its Redemption stood at $100,777.00
2. "Other Advances" include an amount of $956,118.00 advanced in anticipation of Loans.

M. V. WILLIAMS,
Acting Accountant General.
TREASURY CHAMBERS,
SAINT VINCENT, W.I.,
19th January, 1961.


830,355.00


S531,336.00

.206,985.00 324,351,00

2,700,500.00










Statement of Assets and Liabilities of the Colony of St. Vincent as at 30th September, 1960.


1959
$ c.

1,879,122.00







1. 17,200.l'0


$


D POSITS:-

Special Funds

Other than Special Funds

OVERDRAFTS:-

C. A. Joint Consolidatfd Fiund


c. $ c.


...'2,049,985.00

... 100,902.00 2,150,887.00



9614. ()0.00


35,322.0(1 Colony Reserve Fnnd


3.0 1 -.4 4.00


1959
$ c.

1,379.747.00( ADVANCiS:-

Pe rsonal

Other

326,872.00 CASH :-


801,1t20.00

550,405.00


Hl.arclays Bank

Drafts ;aril Reiitince.s

Impre's'

'I'reiasLiry iind' Snlh-Atccointlants




(!ro i.v Ag-nl.s (Clirrenit



GItENRAL RxIVENUIc BALANCE :-
Surplus ani Deficit

LESS :--Halance as at 1. 1. 60


3,151,0()9.00 3,061.644.00


S c.



... 292,367.00

....1,123,150.00



... 498,154.00

... 1.987.00

... 19,185.00

.. 107,671.00

626,997.00


... 394.00


1,415,517.00














626,603.00

830,366.00


... 485,508.00

.. 206,985.00 278,523,00

3,151,009.00


NOTES:-- At 30th September, 1961). the iPublic Dent of the Colnny (not recorded in the above Liabilities) stood at $18.05.25.0) and Lhe accumulated Funds for its Redemption stood-at $102,286.00
2. "Other Advance"'' include an amount of $956,118.00 advanced in anticipation of Loans.


TRLEASURY CHAMBERS.
SAINT VINCENT, W.I.,
27th January, 1961.


M. V. WILLIAMS,
Acting Accountant General.


I II


35,322.00









HANSARD.

PROCEEDINGS AND DEBATES IN THE FIRST SESSION (1957-58) OF
THE LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL, COLONY OF ST. VINCENT,
BRITISH WEST INDIES.


6th Sitting (Budget Session)


Monday 10th February, 1958.


The Honourable Legislative Council met at 10.00 o'clock this morning.

[MR. PRESIDENT in the Chair]
His Honour A. F. GILES, Administrator.

PRESENT:

The Honourable N. A. BERRIDGE, Acting Crown Attorney,
S B. R ~roMAs, Financial Secretary,
S E. A. C. HUGHES, First Nominated Member,
S A. C. CYRUS, Second Nominated Member,
. E. T. JOSHUA, Minister for Trade and Production,
. S. E. SLATER, Member for North Leeward,
. C. L. TANNIS, Member for the Grenadines,
. H. F. YOUNG, Member for South Leeward,
S L. C. LATHAM, Member for South Windward,
S A. B. DOsSANTOS, Third Nominated Member,
E. S. C'AMPBELL, Minister for Communications and Works,
S H. A. HAYNES, Minister for Social Services,
S Mrs. I. I. JOSHUA, Member for North Windward.


PRAYERS

The President opened the meeting
with the reading of prayers of Council.

ADDRESS BY THE PRESIDENT
MR. PRESIDENT: Honourable Members,
the proceedings in this House this morn-
ing will be the same as those on the
same occasion last year: that is, after I
have delivered this Address, speeches in
reply to it will not be called for, but the
Financial Secretary will move the First
Reading of the Appropriation Bill. When
that stage is complete I will read the sec-
ond Certificate of Urgency and the


Second Reading of the Bill will be taken.
The Financial Secretary in dealing with
the Bill at that stage will open a debate
by giving an outline of the Budget which
is being laid before the House, and ana-
lysing its implications. Thereafter the
debate on the Second Reading will be
open to the House, and Ministers will
take the opportunity of underlining and
explaining the main points falling un-
der their departmental estimates, and
Members of the Opposition will have full
opportunity of commenting and criticis-
ing.

I think the House will agree that as
this Government was not formed until









the beginning of October last year, the
Ministers and the Financial Secretary'
are to be congratulated on being able to
present the Budget to the House in the
early days of February; especially when
the formulation of that Budget has again
necessitated the visit to London of a
delegation.
Things move fast these days; last year
we were examining the first budget un-
der the Ministerial System; this year we
are considering the last Budget under.
the old system of Treasury Control. From
1969 onwards, although Her Majesty's
Government will maintain certain rights
of consultation and oversight of our fin-
ances, because they are providing at one
degree removed the money for the
Grant-in-Aid, our immediate concern
will be with the Federal Government,
and our discussions as to the details of
our Grant-aided Budget and the size of
our Grant-in-Aid will be with them.
I would like to draw the House's atten-
tion to some points of presentation in
which the Estimates differ from past'
practice. It will be noticed that in every
ease the individual departmental esti-
mates show an increase over last year.
These increases are not so significant as
they look, because last year the 20% in-
crease on Civil Service salaries was shown
asalumpsum attheendof the Estimates,
and this year it has been included as a
separate item under each departmental
Head. Also last year, and in previous
years, the expenses for transport, and
for payment of electrical power, were
charged to two consolidated items. This
year in order to Improve control and
effect economy we have split these votes
up and made provision under each de-
partmental head for the transport and
electricity required by that Department.
There is also the category of Deferred
Maintenance. Honourable Members will
recall that in previous years this was
shown as a separate head of the Esti-
mates under Public Works. This year
the amount has been included and item-
ised under Public Works Extraordinary,
and this means that in. future dealing
with the Federal Government there can


be no, question of regarding Deferred
Maintenance as an item which must
.come to an end at any given period; it
has been accepted' as pa~t' of the provi-
slon for Public., Works Extraordinary,
thus raising the total provision under
this Head which has been accepted as
reasonable.
It will be recalled that last yea the
main increases were seen under tle Pub-
lie Works Estimates, particularly provi-
sion for better maintenance of our roads,
and a hundred thousand dollars fbr De-
ferred Maintenance. The standard of
these votes, the improved figures have
been maintained this year, and even
slightly increased, but It will be seen that
the main increases on this occasion are
in- the Departments controlled by the
Ministry for Social Services. I think it
will: be caoMdered fair that this group of
Departments this year should have Its
turn.
I think the House will agree when it
considers the increase of Grant-in-Aid
again this year that Her Majesty's Gov-
ernment in Britain, in the face of their
very real economic difficulties at this
time, have been not ungenerous in the
provision they, have been able to make
for St. Vincent, and. I know the delega-
tion are of that opinion. Their success
in persuading the British Government
and. the British Treasury to give us even
more this year than last year has given
us not only a reasonable standard for
our public -administration for 1958, but
also, and most importantly, a firm base
from which to conduct discussions with
the Federal Government about Grant-in-
Aid in future years.
But I must repeat the warning' which
I gave to the House last year: and that
is:-we have no margin. We have ob-
tained an Increased Grant-in-Aid, and
we have increased our original Esti-
mates of Revenue, after careful consid-
eration and I think not unreasonably,
but we cannot expect to come out of the
year with a surplus. In other, .words,
Ministers and Heads of Departments
must not work on the assumption as was
sometimes done in past years, that addi-
tional expenditure will find easy appro-







"anl awards the end of the year. We must
Artm our expenditure to 'the Estimates
appweamed.Ay this House, and endeavour
to do the year's work within the year's
budget.
In opening the debate on the Second
Reading of the Appropriation Bill the
Financial Secretary will explain the
main provisions and analyse the finan-
cial position of St. Vincent for the com-
ing year. For my part I propose merely
to sketch out the general outline of the
Budget 'which is now -being laid before
the House.
Local 'Revenue for 1957 was estimated
at nearly two million, six hundred thou-
sand dollars. This year, our estimate is
over two million, eight hundred thousand
dollars; an increase of over two hundred
S'thousand dollars. But, our Estimate of
,Expenditure in 1957 was nearly three
million, seven hundred thousand dollars.
And for this year our estimate is over
four million, one hundred thousand; an
increase of over four hundred thousand
dollars. To meet these deficits we ob-
tained in 1957 a total Grant-in-Aid of
one million, one hundred and forty
thousand dollars. And for 1958 we have
obtained a Grant-in-Aid of over one
million, three -hundred thousand; an in-
-nrease of Grant-in-Aid of approximately
:one hundred and eighty thousand dol-
ars-equal to the gap I have just indi-
cated, between the increase of our local
arveaue, and the greater :increase of our
expendibure-and while we may be grate-
ful that our normal level of administra-
tion', as been maintained, and even in
some .necessary instances improved, to
a satisfactory standard, we cannot with-
out deep concern note that our Grant-
in-Ad-. has had to go up in the course of
.only three years from four hundred and
Ifty-Ave thousand dollars in 1955 to
meanly :three .times that amount in 1958,
even although our local revenue has
,been,.rdsing, albeit at a slower rate, over
:the .sae period.
As Tl.kave said, the main increases this
year. se to be found in the Departments
,whiek. come under the Minister for Social
Ber-ies. First of all, there is the In-
aorease in the Education Vote due to the
implementation of the Petter Report,


.nd the improved scales for Primary
School Teachers. Then there is the ne-
cessity of Staff for new schools. This is
an example of a CD. & W. Scheme being
implemented and having its consequen-
tial effect upon our Budget. A second ea-
ample is the case of the Hospital. The
first part of the extension to the Kings-
town Hospital has, I -am glad to say, been
completed, that is the new ordinary
male and female wards, and therefore
we have had to increase the Staff. That
accounts for a large part of the increase
of the Medical Vote. We have also made
increases in the allowances to the Nurses,
increases which some say are overdue.
Increased costs have also -made t ne-
cessary to increase the medical provision
in the Budget merely to maintain the
.same standard as before; and with the
happy arrival in, St. Vincent of a number
of Doctors to complete our establish-
ment, naturally the amount of drags and
dressings prescribed has increased.
There is an increase in the Police Vote
which is due partly to the final creation
of the scale of First Class Constables to
bring senior Constables into line with
Grenada as was forecast last year; and
partly to the :establishment of a small
*permanent fire ,squad, not to take the
place of our much admired and very
valuable Volunteer Fire Brigade, but to
supplement it, by using the new fire en-
gine which we hope will be provided un-
der the Airfield Scheme, and which will
be shared between the Airfield and the
town of Kingstown.
Lastly, I would draw attention to the
increase under Expenditure Head 26--
Public Works Extraordinary. This, at
first sight appears to be the startling
figure -of one hundred and sixteen thou- -
sand -dollars. But the House will remem-
ber that I have already explained that
one hundred and two thousand dollars
has been transferred to this Head from
the old Head 27-Deferred Maintenance.
Nevertheless, the increase of fourteen
thousand dollars to be spent on work is
exceedingly welcome.
It has been customary in the past for
the Administrator In his Budget Address
to review the events of the year whioh
has passed. On this occasion I find my-








self with something of the characteris-
tics of the Roman god Janus who gave
his name to the month of January, and
who had one face looking forward, and
one face looking backward; and I there-
fore do not propose to conduct any wide-
ranging review of 1957; I will confine my-
self to reminding the House of that fine
occasion here when St. Vincent was able
to play host to the Regional Economic
Committee, and thus see the last meet-
ing of that body which had played its
part in leading through the years to-
wards the goal of Federation-that goal
which we have now seen achieved, and
marked by the visit here in the last few
days of our first Governor-General of
The West Indies.
In September there came the General
Elections, and the new Government was
formed at the beginning of October. One
of the first acts of the new Government
was to agree to invite here a team of Ex-
perts to survey the agricultural develop-
ment of St. Vincent. That team arrived
a month later led by Mr. Frampton, the
Comptroller's Agricultural Adviser, arid
we now await its report. I am sure that
one' of its main recommendations will be
that we should make every endeavour to
maintain our mixed economy, because
the variety of our crops is our safeguard.
Last year I was able to forecast that
banana production would probably
reach an export total of a million stems
in the course of the year, and that tar-
get has in fact been reached, and even
exceeded. But although we welcome the
tremendous increase of bananas, and
the money which they bring, this Gov-
ernment is also very concerned to see
the Arrowroot Industry continue and
thrive, for it is fully aware of the many
advantages that industry has for St.
Vincent; giving us another crop, proof
against hurricanes, able to thrive in
windy spots and in parts unsuitable for
bananas, a crop which suits the St. Vin-
cent soils and enables us to make full
use of the agricultural and technical ex-
perience which have been gained over
the years; and, of course, the Govern-
ment is aware of the tremendous impor-
tance the industry has as an employer
of. labour.


Last year I referred to the Marketing
Scheme which at that time was held up
as a result of prolonged debate between
this Government and the Colonial Office
as regards the provision of funds for
working capital-whether they should
be C.D. & W. loan funds, or a C.D. & W.
grant. Well, finally a decision was
reached in that matter and we had to
accept a loan; the Scheme has been ap-
proved, this present Government has en-
dorsed it, and a slow beginning is being
made, and we have determined to move
cautiously in this matter in which so
much money is involved and which is of
tremendous importance to the producers
of ground provisions.
Last year I had to report a hold up in
the Scheme for extending the Colonial
Hospital, and I am glad to say that two
new wards of the extension were opened
just before Christmas. Work on the new
Children's Surgical Ward and the Op-
thalmological Ward has now started;
and Honourable Members will observe
provision in the Budget for reconstruc-
tion of the old Children's Ward which
we all know was very necessary.
Then again on the occasion of the last
Budget I had to report that the C.D. & W.
Scheme for rural rehabilitation, funds
to be administered by the Central Hous-
ing and Planning Authority, was also
held up due to debate as to whether the
money provided should be a loan or'a
grant; and I am glad to say that in this
instance we succeeded in persuading the
British Government that the funds
should be a C.D. & W. grant. The Scheme
has been approved and the Central Hous-
ing and Planning Authority are proceed-
ing with its several parts.
During the year as I have already men-
tioned, four schools were built as part
of a School Building Programme. This
programme due to rising costs is one of
the ones that the new Government will
have to re-cast and I cannot say at this
time what exactly will be their proposals
for the next period of the Scheme. The
same applies to the Water Scheme and
Sthe Road Scheme. Costs have risen and
this Government will have to recast both
of these in order to do the best we can.
with the remaining funds available.








As regards water, the first stages of
the major scheme in the Buccament Val-
ley are already under way, and it should
be completed before the middle of this
year.
Turning to Feeder Roads, it is now al-
most possible to drive right from Biabou
along a fine new road up into Simons,
and over the hill down by New Prospect
into Mesopotamia, except for the diffi-
culty of a very small central portion of
the road which will very soon be com-
pleted. And already the greatly increased
cultivation in the area has shown what
advantage these feeder roads can be to
us.
Equally, in the Cumberland Valley it
is now possible to drive on a fine new
oiled road from Coco Village by way of
Spring, three miles up into the hills.
I am glad to be able to say that a de-
cision has been made as the House al-
ready knows to divert sixty thousand
pounds, part of the C.D. & W. funds for
the construction of the Trans-Insular
Road, Ito oil the major part of the road
between Barrouallie and Chateaubelair.
That Scheme has been approved, and as
soon as the equipment arrives-there has
been some delay in shipping-work will
commence. That diversion of funds does
not mean that we have lost all hope of
proceeding with the Trans-Insular Road,
but we have agreed that because fuller
and further investigation is required, it
will not be possible to spend all the funds
earmarked for the construction of it dur-
ing this development period, and rather
than let them lie idle we have diverted
them to this useful purpose. Meanwhile,
the mule trace from Richmond has been
extended to five miles to aid investiga-
tion of the area. Before proceeding fur-
ther we await the Report of Mr. Framp-
ton's Team.
Fisheries was another Scheme on
which I reported last year. In that mat-
ter we have had a further investigation
by Mr. Wiles, the Fisheries Officer from
Barbados, and we await his recommenda-
tions as a part of the Development
Team's Report. But in the meantime we
have succeeded, and I think it is a very
considerable success for the delegation,


in inserting into the Budget an item of
twenty-four thousand dollars for loans
to fishermen; so that that amount will
not be charged against our development
funds. These loans will be controlled by
the Agricultural Advisories Committee
which is advisory to the Minister for
Trade.
A Scheme for a Co-operative Officer
has been approved, but we have not yet
succeeded in recruiting a suitable officer,
though I have hopes that one candidate
will be appointed in the very near future.
A Cane Farming Officer also has not
been recruited in spite of all our efforts,
but again we have some ideas on this
subject which may prove fruitful in the
near future.
The Scheme for the Cane Farming As-
sociation has also been held up due to
various financial questions raised by the
Secretary of State to answer which re-
quires the joint agreement of the Asso-
ciation, of the Company which owns the
Factory, of this Government, and of the
Secretary of State; and as the House
knows schemes which require detailed
agreement by various interested parties
are apt to take longer to conclude. How-
ever, I have high hopes that this Scheie
too will get into its stride this year.
Last year we were under the impres-
sion that a fair portion of the reserve
C.D. & W. money which was under the
control of the Secretary of State might
be allotted to St. Vincent. That expec-
tation has proved both true and untrue.
We have indeed been allotted a large
proportion of the reserve, but it has not
been available for various new schemes
as we had hoped; it has been earmarked
specifically for the building of the Air-
port. The position is that three hundred
thousand pounds from the reserve has
been allocated to St. Vincent and Dom-
inica together. To this is added a hun-
dred thousand from the Central Alloca-
,ion, and fifty thousand from the Wind-
yard Island's Allocation, all lumped to-
gether and allotted to St. Vincent and
Dominica. St. Vincent's share is two hun-
dred and twenty-five thousand for build-
ing an airfield at Amos Vale. The Min-
ister concerned in consultation with the








Director of-Civil Aviation has .drawn :up
a detailed scheme for proceeding with
this work and that scheme is at present
delayed only by the necessary examina-
tion by the Secretary of State for the
Colonies, and by the Ministry for Trans-
port and Civil Aviation in London. But
again I hope that the scheme will be ap-
proved in the very near future. We at
this end are doing everything we can to
get it started, and it is only necessary
examination in London that is holding
us up at .the moment.
Honourable Members in earlier years
the President has delivered his Budget
Address knowing that all Unofficial Mem-
bers really -regarded themselves as the'
Opposition. Last year, he delivered it
knowing that although he spoke largely
on his own part, and still had a Govern-
ment prepared to support its own Budget
there was an Opposition ready to "walk
stick" on his Address. This year he
speaks under similar conditions, but is
in some doubt as to whether on this oc-
casion the Budget will pass without de-
bate.
Nevertheless, I shall listen to the Fin-
ancial Secretary recommending it to the
-House in the belief that what !has been
prepared and -presented by this Govern-
ment will conduce-in the words of our
prayer-'1to -the peace, prosperity, and
Welfare of St. Vincent."
BILLS
FIRST READING
A Certificate of Urgency in respect
of the Appropriation (1958) Bill was
laid on the -Council Table by the Hon-
ourable Crown Attorney.
HON. FINANCIAL SECRETARY: Mr. Presi-
dent, Honourable Members, I have the
horfour to move the introduction and
First reading of a Bill for an Ordinance
to provide for the service -of the Colony
Jor the 'year tending the thirty-first tday
of December One 'thousand nine hun-
dred and fifty-eight.
HON. CROWN ArTTRNY:w I second the
motion.
Question put and carried.


ScoNw D IanDo r:
The President read his Certificate of
Urgency to permit the Bill to -be taken
through all its stages at the present
meeting.

HON. FINANCIAL S(aETraR.: Mr. Presi-
dent, Honourable Members, I beg .to
.move -that the Certificate -be accepted.

H a. Ceowr ATroNza : I second -the
motion,

Mr. 7PRxs= r: Honourable. Members,
there is a motion before the House. Is
there any opposition to that 'motion?
Motion put ,and carried.

Hox. IFmasozNL :BucaranRY: Mr. Presi-
dent, :~onoarable Members, I have the
.honour to move that a bill for an
Ordinance to provide for the senatee of
the Colony for the year ending the
'thirty-first day of December One Thous-
and Nine Hundred' and fifty-eight to
be read a second time.

HON. CaoWN ArTTOIRN.: I second the
motion.
Question put and carried;

Mr. BREmaExD : Is there -ay debate
on the Bill?

HoN. F 2AcmAL ~EoRETBRT: Mr. Pre-
sident, Honourable Members, I rise -to
move the Second Reading of the Appro-
priation Bill for 1958. Last year I ex-
pressed my pride in being the first to
present a Budget under, the 'Ministerial
form of :Government 'in this Cdlony. So
rapid has been the march of events that
1 am, within the space of one ,yea, the
last ,to do so under-a system.of Govern-
ment which, because we are.grant aided,
involved a .certain amount .of financial
control by the Secretary of State, The
operation..of the detailed controls form-
erly exer.lsed.by the Colonial Office.and
Treasury will be. modified and many of
these functions will be taken ,aer by the
Federal Government.








I aa: also privileged to be in at the
beginning of another era in which St.
Vincent. became part of a new nation
and made provision in the Budget for its
financial contribution to that ideal. A
symbol, it you like, of our intention not
only to become a nation but also of our
wilingnes to work and pay for it up to
the. maiommi of our capacity. An am-
bition; which is surely worthy of our
highest endeavour and also of the sacri-
floes, which we will be called upon to
make in, the years: ahead.
in: rising, to move the Second- Reading
of- this. Bill: r am therefore very sensible
of the historic events: which are taking
plane' andt the part which I have been
given, Wtplay in them.
BR-Vn.
Last year I referred to the rather sole
task of former Financial Secretaries in
preparing the revenue estimates and of
how my labour had been lightened by
the assistance of the Minister of Trade
and Production. There had undoubtedly
been, a. tendency in the past to regard it
as the business of the Financial Secre-
tary to find the money and the concern
uf Ministers of how it should be spent.
'lha result was that the Financial Secre-
tary. came to be regarded as a kind of
inverted Micawber: always waiting for
something to turn down, and not always
has it been appreciated that this rather
dismal role has not been of his choosing.
I can assure you that he would have
much preferred being able to say 'yes' in
the Knowledge that the money was avail-
able.
This year the job of compiling the rev-
enue estimates,. that is, finding the
money, has been spread over an even
wider field, and all Ministers have been
engaged'in the detailed examination of
our;oururces of revenue. I hope they have
benetfled from this- combined exercise
as' much as I have. I know I learned
much from it and a number of construc-
tive. proposals emerged from our joint
efforts. Some have already been imple-
mehted whilst others will be examined
in. detail in the near future, and in due
course proposals will be put before this
HoUse to'improve our position.


In. preparing the revenue estimates we
also had one great advantage over pre-
vious Governments. With the co-opera-
tion and kindly assistance of the Barba-
dos Government our imports statistics
are prepared mechanically by that Gov-
ernment's Statistics Department, and I
would here like to express our apprecia-
tion of their helpfulness in this matter.
This resulted in our being able to base
our revenue estimates on much more up-
to-date information than had been avail-
able in the past Armed with this valu-
able data we set about calculating the
likely revenue in 1958 and arrived at
what we regarded as realistic estimates,
but they were perhaps a little conserva-
tive.
The Colonial Office and the British
Treasury thought so too, and it was
agreed during the subsequent discussions
in London that some of them could with
prudence be increased. By that time we
also had even more recent figures relat-
ing to 1957 which justified a more opti-
mistic view of the prospects for 1958. It
was also agreed by the Colonial Office
that if some unforseen and unfortunate
events occurred which prevented our re-
vised estimates being achieved a sympa-
thetic hearing would be given to helping
us out of the difficulties arising from
such circumstances.
The amended total of estimated rev-
enue for 1958 has therefore been agreed
at a- figure of $2,814,690, an increase of
$207,660 over the revised estimate for
1957.
This follows the pattern of the five
years ending the 31st December, 1957
during which period the revenue in-
creased, from $1,875,000 in 1952 to a re-
vised estimate of $2,607,000 in 1957; an
increase of $732,000. This is encouraging
and Justifies the further estimated in-
crease of approximately $208,000 in 1958.
As it is to be expected the main in-
crease is in Import Duties from which we
expect to receive $190,000 more than last
year, bringing this source of revenue t6
over the $L million mark for the first
time in our history. Export duties should
increase by $40,000 over last year, thus
restoring the position to-what it was be-
fore the export duty on arrowroot was








reduced in 1956. The continued expan-
sion of our banana exports, of course, ac-
..junts for this increase and our only re-
gret concerning this head of revenue is
that the production of arrowroot is not
being kept up as well.
Excise duties, however, are expected
to be $25,000 lower than in 1957 which is
due partly to the 1957 figure being over-
estimated. But it is significant that the
quantity of imported spirits was fifty
per cent greater in 1957 than in 1956.
indeed there was a time when it looked
as if our local product was losing favour,
but later it regained some of its popu-
larity under another name. More recent-
ly it has become apparent that the con-
sumption of spirits of the imported and
the local variety is on the increase, with
imported spirits gaining in favour as
more people can afford to pay the higher
prices.
The estimate for Other Duties too has
been reduced by $25,000 as compared with
1957 which was also over-estimated. The
large sums collected by way of estate
duty in 1955 and 1956 were exceptional
and the 1958 figure has therefore been
reduced to one which we can expect in
a normal year.
It is reasonable to assume that
licences will increase by $5,000 due main-
ly to more vehicles being licensed for
the transport of bananas, the increased
production of which should also result
in more revenue from other licences.
Income tax collections which were dis-
appointing in 1957 should be substan-
tially more in 1958. Compared with the
original estimate for 1957 we expect an
increase of nearly $40,000, but some
$90,000 more than actual collections in
1957.
Here I should mention that Govern-
ment has reason .to believe that the pay-
ment of income tax is being evaded to a
serious extent and to collect the sum of
nearly $440,000 in 1958 it will be necessary
to strengthen the inland revenue staff
in the manner which will be explained
when dealing with the expenditure esti-
mates.
An increase of $7,000 is also antici-
pated in Port Dues and the reason is
again banana shipments.


Head 8, Other Fees, which represents
the revenue received for departmental
services' shows a net reduction of $53,890.
This is not, however, a true loss in rev-
enue but rather it is the result of certain
changes in accounting procedure. Cre-
dits in respect of transport charges, for
example, will in future be dealt with
through a suspense account under Ex-
penditure Head 25, Item 30, in the same
way as Unallocated Stores are accounted
for. Other items have been transferred
to Revenue Head 11, Rent and Interest,
which shows an increase of $26,050 from
which it will be noted that such under-
takings as the Land Settlement Estates,
the Ginnery and the Central Arrowroot
Factory will be charged with interest on
the loaps advanced to them.
So much for the revenue, which as
stated previously, is expected to increase
by $207,660 to $2,814,690 in 1958, and it
remains to mention that only in two in-
stances has provision been made for
higher rates, viz., the charges for storing
goods in the Customs Warehouses, re-
garding which certain proposals will be
submitted to the House soon, and the
rents for post office private letter boxes
which were increased recently. How
much longer we can go on without in-
creasing other taxes and charges I do
not know, but some increase must inevit-
ably be faced sometime if the various
public and social services continue to ex-
pand as they have' done in recent years.
ExPENDrrrTm.
With regard to the Expenditure Esti-
mates I will give only a broad outline of
what is proposed, leaving it to the Min-
isters to deal with them in detail later
in the proceedings.
Here the story is much the same as
with revenue. The annual average in-
crease of the order of $350,000 which has
occurred every year since 1952 is repeat-
ed again in 1958, but it is to go up by an
even larger amount. The total is esti-
mated at $4,138,740, an increase of
$459,670 over the revised estimate for
1957. It is, as in previous years, an in-
crease which we cannot meet wholly
from our own resources and the grant
in aid has had to be increased to cover
It.








All departments show substantial in-
creases as compared with last year, but
I should explain that they are not as
great as they appear at first glance. In
1956 and 1957 the 20% increase in sal-
aries was shown in a single 'block' vote,
but in 1958 this has been split up among
the departmental estimates, and ac-
counts for a total of $215,000 transferred
from Head 32 which has been reduced
accordingly.
Electricity and transport charges are
now provided for in the departmental
estimates in consequence of which reduc-
tions will be found under Head 16, Mis-
cellaneous and Head 25, Public Works
Recurrent. These accounting changes
involve the transfer of about $45,000 to
departments and should also be taken
into account when making comparisons
with 1957.
As you will have supposed the highest
increase is to be found in the Education
estimates and it amounts to nearly
$280,000 out of which about $150,000
is for increased salaries to primary
school teachers. A great deal has
been said about the transfer of head
teachers but one may well ask whether
the substantial overall improvement in
the salaries of about 500 other teachers
has not been lost sight of in these dis-
cussions.
Provision has also been made for ad-
ditional staff and equipment for the new
schools which have been built under the
C.D. & W. Programme.
The increase of $37,500 under Agricul-
ture includes a sum of $16,000 odd for
special expenditure to carry on the work
at Camden Park, the purchase of breed-
ing stock and a land rover for the for-
estry staff.
The Inland Revenue Department's in-
crease of $17,250 includes two amounts
of totalling $7,500 to meet the salary and
other expenses of a temporary Income
Tax Adviser and $2,000 for an additional
inspector. I don't suppose there is any-
thing quite so universally unpopular as
the payment of income tax and it is na-
tural that those liable to pay it should


take every possible advantage which the
law provides to reduce the amount they
have to pay. Indeed it is only right that
they take full advantage of this protec-
tion; that is what the law is for. But the
State has rights too and is entitled to
take such steps as it thinks proper to
collect what is' rightfully due to it. This
is easier said than done and to succeed
it is necessary to obtain the services of
a suitably qualified senior officer of long
experience in the United Kingdom or
elsewhere to handle the more difficult
cases involving large sums of money.
Government is convinced that if it could
get somebody, which for the lack of a
better description we will call an adviser,
the income tax collections would increase
substantially. It is possible that the
other Windward Islands will wish to
share the services of this officer in which
case his salary and expenses will be ap-
portioned on a basis to be decided.
Then again the rapid expansion of the
banana industry should bring many
more people into the income tax-paying
section of our community, but they will
not enter the fold willingly and it will
take a great deal of detailed examination
of their affairs before they can be con-
vinced of their new status as payers of
income tax. An additional inspector is
therefore necessary to cope with what
we hope will be an influx of new income
tax payers. Here it would also be appro-
priate for me to mention that it is pro-
posed to adopt a much firmer attitude
towards those who do not keep proper
books of account as provided by the law.
It is not only peasants and small busi-
nessmen who have failed to comply with
this requirement in the past, others of
whom one would expect more satisfac-
tory accounting records have been equal-
ly guilty in this regard.
Another substantial increase is that
of $24,000 under Loans and Advances
which is intended for loans to fishermen
with the object of helping the fishing
industry.
The next big increase $103,580 is under
the Medical vote which provides for
additional staff and supplies for the ex-









tension to the Colonial Hospital, an
improved diet for patients, and more
generous allowance for some of the staff.
The Pensions votes has also gone up
by $43,500 but this is not altogether a
new increase since it was necessary to
approve of supplementary provision in
1956 and 1957. Additional provision is
also being made in the hope that some
increase may be made in the cost of
living allowance to the more needy of
our pensioners. This matter is, however,
still under consideration on a Windward
Islands basis and no decision has yet
been reached.
It has been said that a Policeman's lot
is not a happy one and most.certainly 22
of the former grade of constable had
good cause for complaint. When the
salary scales for the lower grades were
increased last year these men received
no benefit because they were already at
or above the maximum of the new salary
scales. It has therefore been decided to
place the constables into 2 grades with a
higher maximum salary for 22 of them
who will be designated First Class
constables.
Provision is also made for the begin-
ning or a separate Fire Service Section
of the Police Force which has been
increased by one corporal and five
second class constables. It is realized
that this staff is inadequate and that it
will be necessary to draw on the main
police force for this service for some
time to come. But it is a beginning.
The higher house allowance approved
for the Police Force has been extended
to the Prisons which accounts for $2,000
whilst it is also intended to provide a
new vehicle costing about $4,000.
I will leave the Public Works Esti-
mates to be dealt with by the Minister
of Communications and Works and men-
tion only my own personal pleasure at
the disappearance of the term "Deferred
Maintenance" which was used to des-
cribe major repairs and reconstruction
which had been neglected in the past
owing to inadequate funds. They are


now included under Public Works Extra-
ordinary and it will be noted that there
is a net increase of $14,000 on the
combined totals.
Under Subventions is included the sum
of $119,350 which is'our contribution to
the Federal Government. But I should
point out that we will from this year
cease making separate contributions to
various West Indian institutions such as
the University College of The West Indies
and other educational and research
organizations. The responsibility for
these services which used to cost us
about $60,000 per annum will be trans-
ferred to the Federal Government so the
net increase on this account is about
$60,000.
The only item of note in the Treasury
Estimates is the purchase of an account-
ing machine costing $2,800 which we
hope will result in our accounts being as
up to date as our trade statistics. There
can be no real control over revenue and
expenditure if our accounts are in
arrears.
These and other smaller increases
which will be found in the Draft Esti-
mates bring ordinary expenditure up to
$4,138,740. This exceeds local revenue by
$1,324,050 which is the amount of grant
in aid approved by the Secretary of State
for 1958.
I am sure the Minister of Trade and
Production and the Minister of Com-
munication and Works would like to join
me in expressing our appreciation of the
reception we received at the hands of
the Colonial Office and Treasury in
London. We were warned that owing to
the financial position in the United King-
dom and the urgent need to limit expen-
diture to the 1957 level we could expect
little, if any, increase on the 1957 grant.
But the delegation did succeed in getting
more and the Ministers concerned
should, I think, be congratulated on the
success of the mission and on the
manner in which the negotiations were
conducted. There was nothing bf a
clamant nature about it; but our needs
were convincingly stated as the result
has shewn.








C.D. & W. PROGRAMME.
I will now refer briefly to the Colonial
Development and Welfare Programme
for 1958. Honourable Members will note
that the rate of expenditure has been
increased by about $76,000 over that of
1957 to approximately $880,000. This is
because several schemes under consider-
ation this time last year have since been
approved and have now been included in
the 1958 Estimates. Another reason, of
course, is that the necessary staff and
equipment has also become available
whicl will enable progress on the various
schemes to be accelerated. In all these
development programmes it is very much
a case of the three Ms, first the money
then the men and the materials, and at
last all three are becoming available.
The programme is the -same as was
approved by the former Government and
strikes a fair balance between the social
and economic needs of St.-Vincent. But
it does not of course preclude the present
Government from making such adjust-
ments as it deems necessary in the light
of more recent events. It may also be
considered desirable to make some
changes on grounds of policy, and it will
therefore be subject to review from time
to time.

CONCLUSION.


To sum up:-
Ordinary expenditure
estimated at
Ordinary revenue is es
mated at

Excess of expenditure o
revenue covered by grs
in aid

C.D. & W. Expenditur
covered by C.D. &
grants

Honourable Members, I r
lir cn how these figures
pat.3:rn .f the past five year
elusion I should like to giv
brief resurm of what happy
time.


is

-ti-


$4,138,740
-2.814.690


In 1957 our revenue was about $3/4 mil-
lion more than it was in 1952 but in the
same period our expenditure went by
$13/4 million; i... j than double the
increase ii revenue. The grant in
aid which was nil in 1352 amounted to
$1,140,000 in 1957 and will increase still
f:eithli to $1,324,050 in 1958. One may
ask how this grant in aid has been used.
Very roughly I would estimate that about
half is accounted for by increases in
salaries and wages.

First there were the increases recom-
mended in the Hodgens' Report--say
$250,000 per anum. Then came the 20%
salary increase in 1956 costing about
$200,000 per annum and now the higher
salaries for primary school teachers
costing approximately another $150,000-
per annum. There have also been a
series of increases for daily paid staff
and in particular I would mention the
25% increase in the wages of agricul-
tural workers in 1956 following the re-
commendations contained in the Malone
report. These, of course, followed by in-
creases in the wages of other workers and
yet the wages paid in St. Vincent are
among the lowest in The West Indies so
we have not been over generous in this
direction. The other half of the grant
in aid has been used to maintain the
public services generally and in all con-
science these are also modest enough.
It is interesting and indeed relevant to
compare our revenue and expenditure
figures with our imports and exports.


____ In 1952 the value of our exports was
ver approximately $3.5 million, and by the
ant end of 1957 they had risen to $5.5 mil-
$1,324,050 lion; an increase of $2 million. As in the
case of our Government revenue they
'e have shown a steady and encouraging
W. annual increase in volume and value.
...... $ 879,050 During the same period our imports have
risen in value from $4.8 million to $7.5
million; an increase of $2.7 million. You
marked ear- will note that the adverse balance has
followed the increased from $1.3 million to $2 million
s and in con- in the last five years. Stated in terms of
re you a very percentages the value of our imports ex-
)ened in that ceeded the value of our exports in 1952
by 37.14% and in 1957 by 36.36%.









Whichever way one looks at these fig-
ures one comes back to the inescapable
fact that we in St. Vincent as a whole
are spending more than we earn and we
have been doing so for some years. It is
a most serious and difficult problem and
any further improvement in the stan-
dard of living in St. Vincent will depend
on the extent to which it can be solved.

HON. E. S. CAMPBELL: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I arise to support
the Honourable Financial Secretary in
the Second reading of the Appropriation
Bill for 1958. Being charged with the
administrative responsibility of direct-
ing the Departments of the Post Ofice
and the Public Works (including Lands
and Survey), and the Telephone De-
partment, I shall submit a survey of
these Departments.
I have now taken the opportunity in
dealing with the Public Works Depart-
ment to correct what in the past had
been convenient when the total budget
for the island of St. Vincent was just
about one-half of the total amount of
money the P.W.D. is now authorised to
spend. What I mean is that the Tele-
phone Department and the Survey De-
partment used to be attached to the
Public Works Department, coming under
one Head-the Superintendent of Public
Works, Roads, Water, etc. But today
we have taken the opportunity to de-
sect that Department into three proper
units-the Lands and Survey Depart-
ment, the Public Works Department and
the Telephone Department. When the
proper instruments have been obtained,
the Lands and Survey Department will
no longer be under the control of
the Ministry for Communications and
Works, but will be transferred to the
Ministry for Trade and Production.
In preparing the estimate for the
Lands and Survey Department the
object was to regularise what actually
takes place, and what was not in the
past recorded in the Estimates. Previous
to the year 1952 the Department com-


prised two surveyors, one the Crown
Surveyor and the other an Assistant
Surveyor. The then Crown Surveyor was
given a scholarship and went to the
United Kingdom and never returned.
Two surveyors were borrowed from Trin-
idad and the provision for the two sur-
veyors temporarily put in the Estimates.
As a result of that, the past of Crown
Surveyor was vacant, and the two tem-
porary surveyors remained-the two
temporary surveyors being paid the
same grade of salary. When it was
considered that the staff of the Survey
Department was to be increased, and
the addition of three surveyors was in-
serted, the two temporary surveyors
remained here, and that has caused the
position to be temporarily misunder-
stood. Towards the end of 1956 an at-
tempt was made to rectify that and
appoint one as Crown Surveyor, the
other remaining with a similar salary
but without any basic travelling. But
only one person remained in the post
and there were still two posts, and
therefore I did not like that situation
in the Department. I thought I would
increase the staff to 4 Surveyors, (5
land surveyors were recently trained in
Trinidad) and one of these posts has
been deleted and the other called Crown
Surveyor.

Well, the Estimates presented vwll
show a slight increase. This has tejn
the portion of the increase of sala y
which, in the past, has been c(iarged
to one Block Vote in 1957, E;ti:natis
Head 32. Now it has been split into
var'ic.'.s components and pla el undoi
acha Denartment. This a counts for
the Survey Department increase of
$3,853, but the actual position is that
the cost for the Survey Departnrent hta.i
actually fal'-n, having been reduced by
$3,000 as I will show you now. The
estimate .-mner Other Chargres nas
shL.1 a slight increase of $303 under
the Maintenance and Running of Ve-
hicles. This is because certain charges









were previously met from a block P.W.D.
vote, Cost of Repairs and Maintenance.
This amount, as the Honourable Fin-
ancial Secretary has pointed out, has
been split up and part of it put under
Repairs and Maintenance. With res-
pect to the $40.00 for electricity for all
the Departments. Now every Depart-
ment should take care of its own elec-
tricity account. The position is that
one Department could not be in direct
control of all the service, as they were
called upon to do. Very little regard
was paid to the consumption of the
electricity supply to the Department
and for several years it was found
necessary to supplement the vote for
electricity bills. Having placed them
under each departmental vote this year,
the Head of the Deparment will pay
more attention to the consumption of
electricity supply and there will be no
necessity to supplement the various
votes for 1958.
An attempt is being made in the Sur-
vey I apartment to build up the Refer-
ence Library. There is a small Refer-
ence Library since I was working in the
Survey Office when there were two sur--
veyors, now there is a staff of six sur-
veyors, plus two working under a
C.D. & W. Scheme. The staff has in-
creased and it necessarily follows that
the instruments used by the staff must
also be increased. And this year an
attempt at providing the main neces-
sity for that Department is being made,
and that is a calculating machine cost-
ing $600. That is so much for Lands
& Survey. The Lands and Survey De-
partment for the past year has been
carrying out a regular programme under
Development-a Cadastral Survey-aid-
ed by Colonial Development & Welfare
funds. The progress of this Cadastral
Survey is very slow, and that is because
a Cadastral Survey needs a very large
staff, and if a Cadastral Survey takes
20 years when it is 'completed it is not
worth the cost.' The position would


have to be reviewed, and most prob-
ably something better, something more
immediate and economical, will have to
replace it.
Now, another Department falling un-
der my Ministry is the Post Office. The
Post Office again shows an overall in-
crease of over $12,000 part of which is
not a real increase, but only a transfer
of certain votes which were shown under
other heads. The first, which is the
salary increase of 20%, as, was outlined
for the Survey Office in this case $5,150.
In addition, there is that element of
Maintenance and the running of the
Mall Van which has been transferred
to the Post Office Vote, and that is also
in this case $800. There are other slight
increases, for example conveyance of
malls, due to the increased cost of
transportation.
Under Special Expenditure it will be
observed that the provision of $4,200
has been included for the Mail Van.
This Mail Van is required for the Lee-
ward end. We hope to increase the effi-
ciency of the mail service for the Lee-
ward end of the island by providing a
small mail van to work along the Lee-
ward Coast. For the past three years
the mails for the Leeward end used to
be conveyed partly by sea and there
were many difficulties in that extra
personnel had to be employed to go to
the boat to collect the mails and take
them to the various District Post Offices.
We would be able, with the transporta-
tion of the mails by the mall van, to
serve the Post Offices directly with their
mails. This overall increase of $12,000
under Post Office is partly intended to
increase the efficiency of the service to
the Post Offices. I will mention, too,
that there is an increase in the per-
sonnel of the General Post Office in
Kingstown to relieve the congestion of
that Post Office. Two additional Post-
men were employed to take the malls
in and around Kingstown. This has
proved very satisfactory.






14


Now, in dealing with the Public Works
Department there is one salient feature
in this Department that I would like
to mention. The Public Works Depart-
ment, as provided in the Estimates,
takes care mainly of maintenance. It
is like a man who is getting income
from two sources. From one source he
provides himself with food, clothing and
other necessities of life, and from the
other he provides himself with educa-
tion and entertainment. Well, in the
case of the Public Works Department
the budget of St. Vincent provides fcr
maintenance of various public buildings,
but it is the Colonial Development
which provides for any development,
and therefore the overall increase in the
Public Works Department could not be
compared with the other Departments
in that only extra for the maintenance
is included. We have, as appertains to
every Head in the Estimates, the in-
crease for the 20% salaries and this
increased the P.W.D. vote by $15,570;
and then we have been fortunate this
year to be able to insert in the Estimates
a sum of money to pay for the vacation
leave of daily-paid workers for which
they have become eligible. In the past
the figure inserted has always been a
total joke, and what has been done was
that the daily-paid workers were prom-
ised the vacation leave but never got
it. We have now inserted the sum of
$15,400 an increase of $13,400 so that
in 1958 every daily-paid worker will be
provided with the vacation leave which
is due to him.
There is also a slight increase in the
Public Works Department due to normal
increments, and such increases come to
a reasonable figure. The overall in-
crease of $32,930 therefore accounts for
$30,000 provided for daily-paid workers,
and $16,030 for salary increases. That
is as far as Personal Emoluments are
concerned.

Under Head E.25 which carries the
Recurrent Cost of Public Works Depart-


ment, you will notice an overall cost
of about 4% which is the increased
cost for Maintenance of Public Build-
ings, etc., Roads and Public Services.
Under Item 3 there is an increase of
$8,500 which is based on the percentage
of the capital cost of building. It in-
cludes the cost of maintaining the new
buildings that were built in 1957, the
4 new schools, the addition to the C'olo-
nial Hospital and various slight im-
pro events especially in the Grena-
dines.
Then we have under Maintenance of
Roads an increase of $34,000. This in-
crease is due to the increase of 9 miles
of roads-new roads built from C.D. & W.
Grants. And in addition to this a sad
position exists in regard to our old
roads. Estates have divided up their
lands-sold them out as peasants' hold-
ings, or housing lots, but they have
never put their roads in good condition
and, again it has fallen on Government
to put those roads in good condition.
It necessarily follows that the land-
owners selling lands should be called
upon to put the roads in proper con-
dition before the land is .actually sold.
I was taken to see a site in Trinidad,
it had roads properly oiled, it had elec-
tricity lines and, of course, a water
service prepared, before a lot of that
land was sold. This should have been
started in St. Vincent ten years before
now. Then we have included 17 extra
miles ol road to take care of some of
these private roads which have been
treated badly for some years-many
years, and the extra cost to maintain
these roads have been met from the
budget. Then again under the Public
Works Department you will 'observe that
for the Maintenance of the Villa Sea-
drome the sum of $12,000 has been in-
serted. This has been inserted to take
care of the maintenance of the airport
which in fact was met from Colonial
Development & Welfare funds, but which
will now be taken over by this Govern-
ment.









Under Item 30, Transport, the Hon-
ourable Financial Secretary has al-
ready explained that the accounting
- procedure regarding the transport cost
in the Public Works Department has
been altered. This has been altered
with a view to having more control of
the expenditure on transportation, and
therefore the sum of $55,000 has been
removed and the total vote of $100
which indicates that this item will be
self-balancing item; in other words, at
-the end of the year they will deduct it
without actually spending the amount,
as the cost will be met from a suspense
account, and then the job will pay back
the account. That will give more con-
trol and an idea of how to work out
and rectify the position as regards the
transport. Then, we notice, too, that in
splitting up the recurrent costs are
spending $58,500 on Maintenance of
Buildings, instead of $47,900 as in 1957;
under Water Supply it comes to $10,760
instead of $9,630 as in 1957; and under
Miscellaneous, because of various items
having been taken out, it is reduced to
$47,750 from $90-,300 in 1957.
Then, as has been pointed out before,
the Public Works Deferred Maintenance
has been put under the Public Works
Extraordinary. That also adds up our
total increase to $116,230, which is only
an increase of $14,230 in the overall
picture. This Head in the Estimates
provides no figures that appeared last
year occurring again this year. It is
an entirely new vote. There is no
comparison, except that there is a ten-
dency that the figure appearing under
this Head is more or less the same each
year and, in other words, we have now
started to establish the spending power
under this Head of probably $200,000
as a basis of the Grant-in-Aid in future
years.
The last department that comes under
my Ministry is the Telephone Depart-
ment, which will be separated from the
Public Works Department, which will
be under the Superintendent of Tele-
phones. The provision is for the mini-


mum salary of the post resulting in an
increase to the tune of $380. In ad-
dition to that and the normal incre-
ments is the salary increase of 20%,
which comes under every Head. The
cost of services has not been increased
by much and that is because we could
not extend telephone services. The
position as regards telephones is such
that no extra connection can be made
in 1958, and I will point out that every
effort is being made to have our scheme
that will rectify or replace this short
coming in our telephone system. Re-
cently I sent off a reminder to the Sec-
retary of State for the Colonies asking
him to make haste in obtaining the
report of investigation by the firm so
that we can start plans for a new tele-
phone scheme. Until that is done I will
not at all feel happy about our Tele-
phone Department.
That is a picture of the budget of
St. Vincent as far as the Minister for
Communication is concerned, but in
order to appreciate the various slight
increases in the past I want to make
an overall review in percentages of the
departments. We have been able to
estimate our local revenue to 8.3% over
1957 and we have been fortunate to get
a grant-in-aid which represents an in-
crease of 21.8% over the 1957 aid this
gives us an overall increase of 11.76%
an overall increase of spending power
of 11.76% but this fortunately is not
all that we have, we have also got a
guarantee that if by no fault of ours
our revenue does not come up to our
expectations, the fault will be made
good and due consideration be given
to the Estimate during 1958.
Then our expenditure under Post
Office is increased by 21.66% that of
course includes the salary increases of
20% and if we remove that, as I was
saying, the overall increase of spending
power is 12.9%. Our Public Works De-
partment under Head E.24 has increased
by 36.2% including 20% salary increase
but when salary increase is removed,
it is just 19.2%. Our recurrent cost has


*









been increased by 3.4% over 1957. Our
telephone cost has been increased by
the same percentage. With this review
that I have given you, Mr. President,
Honourable Members, there will be no
difficulty in coming to the conclusion
that the budget for 1958 has been drawn
up as we take a note of the various
items with no constituency bias what-
soever. It has been drawn up with a
clear overall picture of the island of
St. Vincent as a whole, as this Party
in Power does not represent and there-
fore you have no cause whatever to
complain about the budget of 1958 I
thank you.

HoN. H. A. HAYNES: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I do not propose
to make a lengthy address at this Bud-
get Session. Unlike St. Lucia the visit-
ing delegation to London comprised the
two Ministers-The Minister for Trade
and Production and the Minister for
Communications and Works together
with the Honourable Financial Secre-
tary. I therefore cannot lay much
claim to the result of the grant-i-i-aid,
nevertheless I will like to express my
satisfaction and my deep appreciation
to my colleagues who in London final-
ised many and various proposals sent
by me for my Department, which I sup-
ported. This gives the general public
the idea of the advantage and benefit
derived from a party system of Govern-
ment. Ministers do not regard them-
selves as representatives of the con-
stituency which returned them but as
representatives of the entire island. I
will now like to mention my opinion of
the Financial Secretary. I regard him
as not only a capable and efficient
worker, but also honest and hard-work-
ing. I am sure he gave my colleagues
ample support in London, and as I con-
gratulate them on the capable job they
did, I ask that he be included. Of the
numerous Departments that come under
my Ministry, I would like to say a few
words on three. Of course Education


must be one. Medical the other, and a
short point on Prisons. There is only
one point 1 will like to make on Prisons,
and that is the increase of $2,210 for
House Allowance for Prison Officers
bringing this Department on par with
the Police.

Medical: There are several increases
in this department, which I would like
to mention. There is the increase of
another storekeeper who must be a dis-
penser. The addition of another male
nurse, the increase of three department
sisters, two staff nurses and ten student
nurses. The increase from 80 cents to
85 cents per day for dietary; although
it appears to be very small, resulted
in the increase of $2,710. General Diet-
ary for the institutions came to $22,970.
The increase in Quarters allowance for
nurses resulted in $2,238. It was in-
creased iro.i $4 per month to $10. There
was an addition this year of uniform
allowance which h came to $1,000 namely
$10 per annum for each nurse. In con-
sidering the various medical districts,
there was an increase in medicines,
drugs, disinfectants etc. which yielded
$6,800. There was also an increase in
Sanitary measures of $5,730. At long
last we should be removing that eyesore
at the Hospital-the old children's ward.
We were able to get $5,000 for the im-
provement and reconstruction of it.
Other incidentals there was an increase,
together with the 20% salary increase
of $103,580, that is last year it was
$510,440, this year it is $622,020..

Education: There is an increase of
three teachers for Private Secondary
Schools, 5C for Primary. These, together
with increased rates for salaries etc.,
raised our Education expenses from
$433,160 in 1957 to $712,270 for 1958.
Despite an increase of $279,110 I cannot
report here that the teachers of St.
Vincent and its dependencies are satis-
fied and therefore happy. Money seems
not to be all. I do hope that on this









occasion next year, if all being well, I
will be able to make a more favourable
statement, as I am anxious to see, al-
though it has all been impressed that
as a Minister I have no direct control
with regards to appointments, discipline,
transfers, or promotions, to rectify this
prolong dissatisfaction of teachers in
St. Vincent.
Regarding Secondary Education, the
need for two secondary schools is long
overdue. "Barking dogs are said not
to bite, therefore I hope quietly to
work steadfastly towards getting two
secondary schools but co-educational
schools. The new science lab for the
Boys' Grammar School I hope will be
finished this year and so we will be
able to further our science education in
St. Vincent and boys will no longer have
to go to Grenada. We hope to cover
at the Girls' High School the plans, to
deal with the various improvements also.
The change of the school hours came
about when it was discussed that a
seventh period was necessary. It was
discussed and decided that as children
work better in the morning and they
were inclined to laze in the afternoon,
an additional period be made in the
morning. I myself do not think that
8.20 is too early for children to go to
school. I am now appealing to the
parents to give us their support, for
without their support no matter what
we do we could not succeed.

HoN. H. F. YOUNG: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I know the lead-
er of the Government so well politi-
cally, that I know he is not going to
speak before the opposition, so I must
take this opportunity. We know each
other for a long time. I will like before
I start to pay tribute to the Mover, our
Financial Secretary, for the able way
in which he has presented this paper.
-Nevertheless, because we have changed
from a Government of assent to a Gov-
ernment of consent. I want to say
that the Opposition or the Government
carrying on have a tight, and I know


that they are in power to spend the
money they want, so let us see how we
can go on.
I have listened to the Finafcial Sec-
retary, and in our Estimate $120,000 has
been included in export duty because
of the green gold'-bananas. Praise
God! That of itself is just direct. The
other points are purchasing of trucks,
increases of gasoline; those are reason-
able points with regard to production-
the 'green gold', so whilst you put in
our estimate here $120,000 for export
duties, there are other kinds cf duty
twice that sum, or three times, which
you get indirectly from that 'green gold'.
I am only reminding the Government
that you must start from the top. It is
only a few years and such a profit to
show you the emphasis on feeder roads
and on the question of our agricultural
issue; what a blessing over night it
would be! To get ba:k to the estimates,
and as a Government branded as a
Social Government with a little tint
of red, who came to power on behalf
of the unfortunate man of this country,
the toiling masses, I am yet surprised to
see the estimate presented on their be-
half. I have seen the same stereotype
civil servant estimate. I did not expect
to hear as a Socialist myself-a christ-
ian one-I was expecting to see the in-
crease in this estimate bearing some
allegiance to the Government who got
in power from the hv.nds of the working
man. What I have seen, thousands of
dollars being spent on major repairs
to Government Bui:dings. Right; you
must maintain them but overnight
thousands of dollars on major repairs,
but in the same. estimate there is still
the same amount for minor repairs for
the same government buildings, that is
another way of dodging in getting extra
money. So as you change the respect-
ive Heads, you have major repairs to
XYZ. ABC, and you still have a block
grant for repairs to buildings, the same
buildings to which you have been doing
major repairs. From those buildings
you spread out over a few years, are




r .'


18


they so rotten that they will fall to
pieces? No but like every civil servant,
and like every departmental Head he
has a right to put forward his case.
What is this Government going to do?
accept it and swallow it? The new
school we were speaking about and with
our nation into being right now, if we
had placed and cut our cloth to suit
our jacket, we could have easily built
a new Secondary School, right now,
from Public Works Extraordinary esti-
mate. And I want to remind the Lead-
er of this Government especially, that
the development of people in this new
nation and the economic development,
and the uprising of the territories must
come first, because after a while when
we are established, and all this grant-
in-aid that We are getting now, from
the Mother Country, after five years
when we don't get it, let us think of
something else like bananas to boose
our economy and the Minister for Trade
and Production will no doubt learn, I
don't expect him to do it, but he can
ask someone else to think of it because
I think the portfolio which the Leader
has for himself, I will dare say, and I
will say it right now, with all due res-
pect to him,. should have been educa-
tion. He has not got the slightest idea
of Trade and Production; therefore you
can see our Estimate taking the same
pattern, and it is a pity, I say that the
three Ministers there wasn't a swop-
the Minister for Social Services turned
into the Minister for Trade and Pro-
duction, and vice versa.
We go on again: I want to congratu-
late His Honour the Administrator and
as a former member of the Executive
Council for bringing about the rural;
rehabilitation scheme, things that we
in the past have known about; the
marketing scheme, and all the other
schemes, that our gentlemen here have
the pleasure of seeing implemented, I
will say well done to the gentlemen who
got them O.K'd from the Secretary of
State; and I will say to them as our


brothers and representatives of St. Vin-
cent, try your best to put them into
implementation, especially the Airport
Scheme. I was. at Antigua not too long
ago, and I love my country and you
want to see the tourist development in
that place. We here are blessed with
a better soil, we are blessed with more
fruits and vegetables that they haven't
got because of their dryness, but as I
heard people-Americans say and I felt
put out that they heard of St. Vincent,
but they can't get here. And I will ask
the Minister for Communications and
Works along with the Administration,
and I think you will take it in good
faith, to try and hurry up the Airfield
it would mean a lot to our econof.y,
and you would be surprised to know that
is the line I believe you should work
out.
In our Estimate is $8,000, I notice the
Financial Secretary has left it out, the
amount for a new launch; try and don't
let it be another Kitty Wake. $8,00
could easily have built another school
and not because it is Government that
private man launch in putting another
launch-we need another launch. I am
not saying that our port officer can
operate without another launch but if
we had cared the launch a few years
ago, we would have saved that amount;
but because it was Government proper-
ty, another $8,000; 'buy one and take
care of it. We cannot afford to spend
money like that, going to pieces. I am
not blaming you, Gentlemen, for the
Kitty Wake. I am not saying that the
Kitty Wake was your responsibility I
am only saying that another $8,000 is
included here and that it needs you to
have that included; but let us be care-
ful with this little money that we have
here. I don't think I should say it, but
I have to say it, whilst you are here,
there is another big issue here in this
Estimate that did not come in the in-
crease-20% of the Ministers' salary.
Gentlemen you do not expect the Op-
position not to say it. That 20% of the


-" .;-,-.^


- .1









Ministers' salary was refused by the
former Government because it was said
that to have prompted certain debates
and that is a fact, and it was refused
because it was just the time before the
Elections, and they thought it a wise
thing so to do, but it was not following
our debate but disguised in the Estimate
hoping that we will not go through
it; but my Gentlemen I will like to
enlighten you of that 20% with a grant-
aided territory, with a Socialist Govern-
ment trying to strive for the betterment
of the poor and unfortunate masses.
20% was passed in this House for the
Government Employees whose fish now
is higher, whose shirt cost him more,
but the luxurious Ministers driving in
their new cars refused to supplement
20% for the same people, but included
20% for themselves, plus entertainment
allowance. Is this an honest Govern-
ment? Is this Government, who climbs
on the backs of the same people, telling
me in the same breath that they are
going to accept the 20% now in the
face of the majority who put them into
power? You are paid servants of the
Crown as I heard once when my hon-
ourable friend used to be on this side.
We Government stooges who once and
now we could see that the Government
stooges have turned the lamb, the wolf
has become the lamb, because he has
got to preach what is the object of the
people who put him there. Where in
this budget, from a socialist govern-
ment, in any part of this, is there any
economic development scheme for or on
behalf of the people of St. Vincent?
As the former Minister for Trade and
Production and as I noticed the Finan-
cial Secretary was so broad to give an
O.K. when he planned and helped with
the estimates. As he planned the ban-
ana scheme today that we see young
girls are being employed. Another form
of employment, we see people in the
country today-imagine the aged women
from my district going to see their rel-
atives in Trinidad because of the eco-
nomic scheme. Where in this estimates


-you Gentlemen should have taken
another two months before bringing
this here, you should have studied
something to offer the people instead
of the Civil Servants have got away
with it from lack of experience to an-
other experience. Have we got ex-
perience, not knowing the economic
status of your country.

Feeder Roads: I notice the Minister
is quite right. Estates have cut their
land up and what a lovely thing they
have done, because not too long ago
peasantry was not good in this island,
and most of us were labourers and a
few shopkeepers; if in cutting that land
up they probably did not make good
roads. I agree they should have good
roads, especially for a housing scheme,
then it is from the production of those
lands that the people are being taken
care of it is from the production of
those lands that build the economy that
has all of us here, and more emphasis
should be placed on the feeder roads
here. I don't know if the Minister for
Trade and Production knows this island
well, he was once a teacher and a schol-
ar, but as Minister for Trade and Pro-
duction I invite him to get a horse and
get into the interior even in his own
Constituency. up into Park Hill and
Byrea and South Rivers, and places
that were long neglected, and get those
roads fixed and all in this new estimate
with buying of launch, creating of new
posts, I did not expect it from a socialist
Government, not putting on a pure red
tie but media via; but what have I
found? I have found that the Leader
of this Government has not especially
he has the opportunity, Mr. President.
Mr. President you must remember con-
stitutional changes and accept them.
Once the Administration was the Gov-
ernment, in creating the last Govern-
ment we came into power in mid-stream
with a Ministerial responsibility, with-
out knowing whether the Estimates will
be approved and we went into Executive
Council, not as a Party but men with









views and different views, with the com-
mon English of the country. We have
succeeded in laying a foundation. This
Government you have is a new form
of Government, a majority-in power
to Executive Council with full-fledged
men inside of it. The P.'.P., I wonder
why it does not sound something else,
but I would not mention it in here, I
will mention that in the market square.
The P.P.P. in power in the new Execu-
tive Council now, as y..u know, with
all due respect to those outside, out-
side of these realms, giving and mak-
ing as order h Lve the right with the
majority at your disposal, especially
knowing the Secretary of State the
amount of grrnt-.n-aid we nave for-
merly, he had a right to cut it. Now
the Secretaly of State don't cut it.
He said: "Take a million dollars and
spend it on your work." Getting back
to the point-Wha& have you put into
this Estimate, what have you seen? The
civil Servants have to work. In this
new nation of ours where education
must be a vital point, where the young
children are still out of school, what
have you done to build a thatched
house to put them under there, instead
of growing up to men and women illit-
erate, twenty or tl-irty years regardless
of what it costs us, they will be res-
pected as West Indians. What are we
going to face Trinidad, Jamaica and
Barbado.~ with? With illiteracy so that
they can fool us still? Are you offering
flowery speeches now? We need flour.
The flo-.,ery speeches in the Market
place, the respons..bdity before us, we
have to offer the people some form of
salvation-education and the economic
development of our Colony. Mr. Presi-
dent I do not expect to stop. I expect
to take this estimates so I am warning
you now as soon as it is possible to
adjourn for lunch as I expect to go on
very much longer. I intend to speak
until tonight, or tomorrow, on every
item here, to show the Leader, which
is my right, of the people scattered
over this island, and I am surprised to


know a full-fledged Government for the
first time in the history of St. Vincent,
for the first time we have a full-fledged
Government, the first time the Gover-
nor-General visited us, the first time
we are preparing to be a young nation,
the same stooges of the Civil Servants
who was yesterday, have fallen into the
same trap.
Arrowroot, let us be constructive. I
believe, Sir, that the payment on
arrowroot should take some different
form. The three payments are not sat-
isfactory to the average man. That
should be left to the big persons con-
cerned, but I agree with you that it
will be a sad thing for us to doubt the
arrowroot and the Sea Island cotton.
As you travel abroad you i-ave a sense
of pride, although we are .noivn in St.
Vincent because we grow the best cotton
in the world. I do not know if my
friend has that feeling. You are :mown
to grow the best cotton i,. the world,
but what is happening now, all lands
are not suitable for bananas, our soil
goes two inches in the rocks wit]. 10.10
fertilizer can produce a lot of cotton.
From that cotton into that ginnery we
get edible oil for our poor people who
are often cheated so we have to ):c care-
ful if we have no cotton we have to
import oil or use the coconut nut. From
the refuse we also get food to feed cows
to produce more milk. Mr. Minister
for Trade & Production, try to learn
now what I am telling you. You have
still get up and an estimate like this have
not offered any kind of encouragement
to the peasants. Thousands and thous-
ands of dollars ever-/ year the same.
but 20% on the salary of the Mi.aisters
have gone up. Houses that house those
people if they are not properly housed,
if they are not fed properly, they can-
not serve this new nation. The devel-
opment of people comes first. Civil
Servants in all fairness to them, in all
branches. the nurses, the policemen;
I am very glad to see you give these
poor chaps a raise, I am going to give
you credit where credit is due; because








sometimes in the country where they
have no house to live, and can't pro-
vide other officers to do anything, they
transfer the boys there.
The teachers, you gave them with
one hand, and instead of fostering edu-
cation, you are interfering with edu-
cation. A man put in a certain village
for example in Biabou, who was res-
pected and has his home there, because
you have put a few cents on his salary
which was long intended for years, you
transfer him to another country dis-
trict where his economy now-leaving
his wife and children and property'-
and leaving his property to set up an-
other home. What you have done then,
our children will suffer; because al-
though" the teachers have got a little
raise, his whole economy is broken up,
and in that pool he will not be able to
produce as much. What you find in our
school? You find children teaching
children, you find the Headmaster is
the only trained teacher; ou find most
of the teachers, he has to teach them.
You take a man like old Webster Clarke,
for years he lived at Troumaca; and
men like Daisley and Sandy, where they
remained in that old place for years,
they became a father to that commun-
ity, or that particular town or village.
Not only the school alone, but outside
the school. Today you have the teach-
ers shifting here and there, like little
boys moving up and down, because
somebody said they got a few more dol-
lars, let us send them away to spend
It. Who are you, creating that prob-
lem for our children. Therefore all the
money in this education vote will go to
pieces because it would, not mesh with
our children, and all the money that
is put in this for education, unless it
mesh to the heart . . . .

HoN. E. S. CAMPBELL: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, the Honourable
Member is asked please to address the
Chair when he is speaking.

Mr. PREwDENr: Will the Honourable
Member please address the Chair.


HON. H. F. YOUNG: I. am very sorry
Gentlemen. Thank you very much. At
the same time I shall try to confine
myself, and please don't take it as an
insult.
Of the teachers in our Primary
School, I would think the Leader of the
Government who was a former teacher,
and who rather than talking in the
Market Square about Shakespeare, and
all other kinds of famous literature
that he is noted for; I would have
thought that he, in a new Estimate
presenting to the people for the first
time in the history of this little Island,
where a full-fledged Party is in power
I am very much disappointed. Educa-
tion, a new Nation, Federation-and to-
day he presents a new Estimate to me
and-Mr. Chairman, today an Estimate
is being presented to us, full, Sir, of try-
ing to buy the vase and not the pot,
that is why I compliment the Financial
Secretary, he has done his job. What
I am trying to say, Sir, is a question
of priority. Mr. X is working for $20
per month and has his wife and children.
He then buys himself the necessities
of life, but he thought he could not
afford to send his children to school,
but instead of doing that he goes and
buys a refrigerator and a car; that is
what this Government is doing. We
are begging, Sir, the British people for
our Grant-in-Aid. They have given us.
We have our economy to uplift to a cer-
tain ....... standard, but when you
look into all that I have seen, it is a
question of more lands at Camden Park,
lands to sell at Camden Park that will
produce. Every estate today that is
owned by the individual ........ is
supposed to pay its way. You have the
Minister who is in charge of agriculture,
the Minister of Trade and Produc-
tion who is in charge of lands, that
can bring a lot of profit and minister
to the economy to the island. What
efforts have they made, what purpose
Js it put in the Estimates. You have
the Land Settlement Board, you still
have to find money for all those estates
with bananas in this drought. You








have 450 stools per day to be broken,
and I am not speaking today, Sir, as a
critic, but as a grower who is supposed
to know. Mr. President the reason why
I am going on to speak like this, and I
should give you the background, this
is our own little colony, not too long
ago the Leader of this Government was
on this side of the House, and he made
the entire population of this country
believe that we on that side of the
House were traitors to this country,
therefore in the face of that I am going
to ...... show the relationship that
we were not traitors, and it is going to
sting; and it is going to hurt, because
it is true, and the truth must stand. In
all his public appearances he made the
people know we were paid stooges of
the Crown. In the first place, who laid,
and who approved the Market Scheme?
Who approved the Airport, and who
agreed that the money should be
diverted across the country and put into
Feeder Roads? I did not say I did, but
we played a part. You know, Sir, be-
cause you were here. Who agreed to
the old School Building Programme,
the Water Supply at South Leeward,
etc., etc. I will right now like to know
what has this Government, who have
a right, offered in the Estimates, and
I have already told you, Sir, what we
offered. They will stay in the Govern-
ment for five years to spend and to
guide what we have left; and up to
now In presenting the whole Estimate,
which I am very thankful for, and which
the Financial Secretary has played- his
part, and he himself has said in his
address, and I am going to quote him
now:-
"Whichever way we look at these
figures, one comes back to the ines-
capable fact that we in St. Vincent
as a whole are spending more than
we earn, and we have been doing so
for many years. It is a mbst serious
and difficult problem and any further
improvement in the standards of liv-
ing in St. Vincent will depend on the
extent to which it can be solved."


The Financial Secretary is so right.
Therefore, if we are spending more, it
behoves this Government now to think
of industrialisation . . to put what-
soever money we have into another form
of production to get into the interior,
and instead of cutting the bank to the
side of the road, prepare a path so that
the poor people can bring their donkeys
out, and in doing that you will see what
bananas you will get in two years; and
what you have seen-you have seen
from lack of experience. The Civil Ser-
vants have taken away the Estimates,
*and they are quite right. They have
put in these Estimates things that would
never happen with the former Minister
for Trade and Production, the former
Minister for Communications & Works,
putting back as people said time to take
care of itself and the Great God of the
Universe must in truth stand as God.
This is the time when they who live
by the sword must die by the sword.
Mr. President, Honourable Members,
The Marketing Scheme, we in St. Vin-
cent have been producing and are-still
producing quite a lot of ground pro-
vision; ground nuts, etc. Our stand-
ards in Trinidad-and sometimes the
poor speculator when he gets there tak-
ing so many bags of potatoes, of course
to sell them cheaper than he purchased
them here. Whilst I was in Trinidad
I spoke to the Chief Minister, Dr. Eric
Williams. During that talk I sought to
establish a Marketing organisation for
us here. There is nothing better for
this island, so that 25 speculators who
are working ..... for years, and you
must give them credit, who decided the
price, more than 5,000 peasants played
a great part but to what extent- he
only purchased enough in order to make
his 100%, but in trying to do that some-
times he took more goods into that
country than the quantity the country
wanted on that particular day or two.
Therefore, with our Marketing Scheme,
if we can so arrange it, then we will
only ship 100 bags, we shall have a mar-
ket with a fixed price over a period of








time, and so help the peasants. It is
no use of us talking about Federation
without hard work. It is no use of us
talking about a new nation and expect
honey and milk is going to drop from
the sky. We want to see this Gov-
ernment now, this Government who
preached around the country that
everything was wrong with the old Gov-
ernment, stop being politicians, become
patrons; start to think of the youth of
our country; start to think .how much
gold we can get out of our lands; start
to think how we can trade within the
regions, so that our money will not go
abroad, because after all, no chain is
stronger than its weakest link. We
have seen our Country-Canada is com-
ing to our aid, Canada from being a
part of the British Commonwealth of
nations have sent down a Housing Ex-
pert. They intend to send down more
experts. We might have sources like
the Columbo plan. We want men now
to think and plan, and if you are an
honest Government, set up committees,
come outside of your realm and get men
with knowledge to advise you. These
are not the days for Market Square
preaching and slandering. These are
days when you have made history by
becoming the first Government, and
today you have presented us with an
Estimate null and void, nothing to offer
for the economic development. Just re-
pairs to buildings, buy another Kitty
Wake; bring another Income Tax man.
And that is one point, Sir, I would like
to tell you about, this Income Tax. We
must have revenue, don't think I am
going to be against ...... it, but the
smaller man in the Country who is
growing bananas, and the man who . .
I don't think it is his own fault, can't
read and write, don't expect him to keep
an account, and now that you are
speaking about revenue, it is because
of his sake you can enjoy $120,000; for
God's sake, in the same breath, don't
try to keep him back from his produc-
tion, from his hardness of going in the
field, from the hardness of his woman


going to work with her load on her
head; they are assisting all of us around
this Table.

Mr. President, we must have more
pride than to continue begging. The
Minister of Trade & Production, in a
brand new Federation here, in a brand
new Estimate, the most grant-in-aid
we ever got, has not put some economi-
cal scheme or some educational scheme
for the people. If you can take one
look in the Estimate, what you have
seen; repairs, major repairs to build-
ings 20% on the Ministers' salaries and,
Mr. President-"Oh Comrades when I
ride a bicycle", but comrade is in big
cars now, and all that tom-foolery and
idle talk had returned him now to power
-through the political ignorance of our
people. Today that same man is around
this Table, with all his political ex-
perience, and has not offered those
people anything in the Estimate.
(The Hon. Member sends for water
and remains silent until water comes).
Mr. PRESIDENT: The Honourable Mem-
ber must continue with his speech, or
sit down.
HoN. H. F. YOUNG: I shall not con-
tinue until the water comes.
Mr, President, now Provisos: Trucks,
..... development, education, federa-
tion, nationhood, all call for a lot of
planning. My friend, whilst he was on
this side moved several motions, Sir,
on the question of compulsory educa-
tion. Fitting it is especially today. How
can we federate, and how can we be-
come a Nation with the majority of our
people not going to school. Our friend
has not even made an effort, although
I believe they say we can't afford. I
say we can afford, not in building walls
and building houses-the palace, Sir,
does not make a home, a home is where
love is. The same way we can make a
temporary shed under some thatched
roof or under some other tree, and get
a teacher who will start to teach them.








He has forgotten all those advocations,
now he has gone over and become gov-
ernment, government stooge, those same
words I can remember them ringing in
my ears. I could remember sometime,
Sir, when I cross the Market Square,
if it was not for fear, I would have
been shot as a traitor. Mr. President,
we stand here face to face now, who is'
the traitor. That is the point I will ask.
Having gone into the Market Squaie
and- fooled the masses all over the
island; now he is in power, and he has
not presented one thing in that Esti-
mate. He has no excuse because the
whole big party is in power. No excuse,
absolutely no excuse, because you Sir,
as you might remember as the old
Chairman, and this Opposition is com-
ing hard because we know what it is
like. We are not criticising and sland-
ering, we are criticising for the rightful
attention of the country, this little
island of ours that is going to take part
in the Federatioon of this young Nation.
"Clay and irun" Mr. President, as my
friend used to say, cannot mesh, but
if you look across you will see clay and
iron. You see one red tie, and some
others not so red, and you see that clay
is leaving the iron. This is a small
country, Mr. President, because a dict-
ator is at the head. All the dictator,
Mr. President, has proved in this esti-
mate, Peron, Mussoline, and all, a demo-
cratic form of government which en-
titles me to speak today; how much I
love it! Otherwise they would have
told me to get outside. But the wills
of the people of South Leeward have
put me around this Table, and once I
am within the constitution and the
rights which I always try to respect,
if I go outside of it, please correct me.
I have no intention to be disloyal.
History has proved this little island,
Sir, when Captain Bligh brought the
breadfruit here ......
HoN. E. S. OAMPBELL: On a point of
order. Is the Honourable gentleman
confining himself to the subject of the
debate?


Mr. PRESIDENT: Yes, I think he is. It
is a wide range in debating the Budget.
HoN. H. F. YomNG: Thank you very
much, Sir. Captain Bligh brought the
famous breadfruit tree. What a bless-
ing to poor people. But that was his-
tory when he landed here. That was
history when he left breadfruit, for us.
The P.P.P. Government came into pow-
er, and that was history c3nstitution-
ally. What are they going to left for
us to eat? That is the whole relevance
of the case, so as we look back in his-
tory we will always praise Captain
Bligh, but I am saying, Sir, that this
Government, in its infancy will always
be saying to us, we just got in and you
start to attack us. I think that is fair,
and I am prepared to give them a long-
er chance before I criticise, but this is
their Budget, so I am not criticising
them for what they did in the past,
this is the time that they have brought
up this, and you know Sir, that we
know that they are responsible to a
great extent for all the items in this
Estimate. They are in the majority
in the Executive Council, and if they
tell you put a glass there or put a spoon
there, or whatever it is within the scope
of that money, you have no alternative
but to say yes. Since that is so, the
Government of consent is the govern-
ment of the people. In the old. days of
Abraham Lincoln, how sad my friend
has failed his people by giving him the
franchise Sir, by putting him in power,
and yet in this paper there is not one
programme for the average man. The
20% increase, Sir, for the daily paid
workers ....

HON. C. L. TANNIS: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I move that this
House be adjourned.

Mr. PRESIDENT: Only one Member
could address .the House at the same
time. Only one motion could be before
the House at the same time. We are
debating the budget and Mr. Young is
speaking.








HoN. H. F. YOUNG (continuing) I in-
tend Sir, during lunch time to prepare
some more, so that is just, to remind
you Sir, that you can adjourn for lunch
because I am going to take Head by
Head.
We take the Legislative Head first:
Allowance to Members of Council. This
was supposed to be a very crucial point
to be debated; but the Government
side slipped it in and thought probably
it would never be debated. There is an
increase of $7,310. In this poor little
island and these same gentlemen Sir,
who claim to represent the poor people
-the increase is made up Mr. President,
of $3,000 alone for the Ministers. $3,000
Sir in a poor country is a very tidy sum.
A scholarship could have been offered
with that sum. And Mr. President, as
the leader of this Government opposed
for the last six years, I was looking
forward that when he got into power
he would do something for his people.
I never expected or never thought-
and- I have no malice because changes
must take place-but from his preaching
I believe that everything was going
wrong in the former Government. I
was really looking forward to some new
hope or some different form of approach
not the same stereotype estimate that
we stooges used to prepare, not the same
stereotype estimate that we who did
not know anything used to prepare.
When I got my revised estimate in my
hand Sir, and I went through it and I
was very much surprised. This could
not be my friend. Has he turned cap-
italist overnight? He has forgotten the
state of realm, he has forgotten the
socialism part of his preaching.

Mr. President, you go to another
Head and you find the Minister for
Communications and Works, his pet
the Survey Department: When he left
the Survey Department he was dis-
satisfied and then he will tell you a
thing or two about it. You heard him
tell us about a cadastral survey and
topographical survey; but you find


what he has told us was that those
surveys would have made us get a
better future. Those surveys would
have made us realise where our bound-
aries are, so that after a few years
where the people below us were working
in on our lands we might have been
able to regain that land as we would
be able to determine our boundaries.
You find the same Minister saying Sir,
that the mail van to Leeward-I won-
der if he does not realise that it is
better to pay for transportation than
to hold up the mails. The cost of this
mail' van to this Government, the run-
ning of it-they wouldn't care it as
much because it is Government's-it
will deteriorate so fast that it will be
better to pay somebody to carry the
mail than to run a van. I believe in
fair exchange and we need sufficiency
but this is an advice. Even estates,
Mr. Minister for Communications and
Works prefer to give their freight to
other truck owners than to purchase
vehicles. Vehicle is very expensive to
upkeep. So in your good effort in try-
ing to give us a better service you would
be spending more on that van. It would
be better to get one or two local people
who own a bus at C'hateaubelair to
drop our mails and you would save a
lot of money. It is better to buy a cow
than to generate it.
You have a separate telephone Head.
You are quite right. But in separating
telephone head you have developed a
man who claims to be a head of de-
partment. Of course you must pay him
more. Paying him more because no
man is going to be called an overseer
and getting a driver's pay. I wonder
if the telephone service will be more
efficient than before. Result is what
the opposition is looking for. Is it just
a question of pet subject of, creating
heads and paying more money? In
creating heads it is time for this Gov-
ernment to realise that this little book
of ours belongs to the people of St. Vin-
cent. It is their taxes plus the help
from the Mother Country, and every




- I' -


iota of this has to be discussed because
it is on this book that the economy
of the island rests, and when we see
boards, mortar and sand going into
buildings and hungry people still exist,
where unemployment still exists, child-
ren are out of school, I will get up even
to send a minority report to the Secre-
tary of State and move a motion of
non-confidence in this Government for
spending funds in the wrong direction.
We have just had the pleasure of the
visit from our first Governor-General.
He told us in a nutshell that the ques-
tion of these small territories is a matter
of economy. He told us that he knew
St. Vincent is in a bad spot financially.
This Government has not studied to
give priority to the things economical
and educational. Instead of that, what
I have seen-from my little experience
and I am going to say that the depart-
ments went out to produce this esti-
mate and they had a right to do it,
because naturally they do not represent
the people in the true sense of the
word; they are servants of policy. This
estimate is the only departmental esti-
mate drawn up by this Government.
Mr. President, the preaching that went
on here will never make me realise,
and I must give credit to all depart-
mental heads. Mr. Brereton from the
Public Works went around and check
all these buildings, and a tidy sum of
thousands of dollars have gone to
major repairs-Major repairs to Police
Stations. But you know what I would
like to see, Sir, in fairness to my friend
is a new hospital at Georgetown in his
own constituency. Being so far, Mr.
President, I would have preferred to
see some thousands of dollars spent on
the medical building at Georgetown
instead of all this. Therefore even his
owfl people- he has neglected, by lack
of experience. Mr. President, we go on
a little further. You have $1,000 in-
crease in the Post Office and the post
office is a great service. The Post Office
is an international organisation and it
is a great service. It is also revenue-
bearing. I agree with the Minister


wholeheartedly in increasing the Post
Office. Our population is increasing,
our economy is increasing and there-
fore it stands to reason that we must
have a little more increase in post.

We go to Prisons: We had a former
Superintendent of Prisons here, Mr.
Anderson, the State is responsible for
the Prison diet, health and everything.
Some time ago the past Superinten-
dent taught the prisoners to be indus-
trious. And you know, Sir, that the
revenue side of the Prisons some years
ago it was a blessing to look at it. And
the new term of prison today is a ques-
tion of reform. It is not a question of
locking up and putting in a cell. As a
matter of fact, I had the pleasure, Sir,
in Antigua, to see a prison without
walls. They were there cultivating land
and the Agricultural Offcers up there
give them advice. It would be better
for St. Vincent Prison to start uack the
Industry. The big estate we have at
Ottley Hall turn it into production,
turn it into a reform school so that
when the boys come back to the co.n-
munity they would come back with a
better knowledge to teach others. Again
we emphasize, the lands at Ottley Hall
if they are not going to use it, what
about turning it into a reform. school?
Are we going to leave our little boys to
grow up like that? What is this Gov-
ernment doing about these projects
they call modern secondary develop-
ment? Are we going to have our little
boys grow up and become burdens, more
and more going to jail and increase the
police force or are we going to start
training them into useful men in this
community? This Government have a
chance to do it. This Government have
a chance to do it because right now
with Jamaica and Barbados having a
better form of constitution even to
Cabinet System, I believe Sir, that we
can have this same sort of constitu-
tion. Speaking to His Excellency the
Governor a few nights ago at the cock-
tail party, he actually told me with re-
gard to the constitution if we want it


;.. ..









we can get it. But would I advocate
to put a wider constitution in the hand
of this Government? It is better to
have duly paid servants of the crown
as children under control because I have
lost faith and confidence in this Gov-
ernment.
We go on a little further: We take
Agriculture which should be the fore-
most department in my friend's port-
folio-Minister for Trade and Produc-
tion. The Agricultural Department at
Camden Park, an experiment station
with extensions throughout the length
and breath of St. Vincent; the cocoa
scheme, the lands at Bellewood, and all
that is suitable, no dissemination of
knowledge. The experiment at Cam-
den Park is being carried out but the
peasants don't know what is going on.
Two thirds of the land is being worked
and cultivated as an estate. Should
that production from Camden Park
carry it? Major repairs to Camden
Park Experiment Station, when you
yourself don't know that Professor Phil-
lips said that there are buildings at
Camden Park superior to the govern-
ment office, and you are going to spend
more money on buildings at Camden
Park. Are we still caring for white
elephants? Lack of knowledge of the
Minister for Trade and Production. The
Minister for Trade and Production by
virtue of his portfolio was just asked to
be on the Banana Board, as a dictator,
but it was mere banana Mr. President
that is -raisihg the economy of this
country. Inst-iad of going there on the
Board, he shcil Id leave that because that
is already est ibiished, and study some
new scheme so that when he leaves this
part of the world and when he leaves
this Council Chamber, we can say well
he has actually pioneered some new
scheme. But what you get, Sir, he is
just nudging, nipping into something
that already exists, hoping to find little
faults here and there, killing the goose
that lays the egg. As Minister of Trade
and Production Sir, right into George-
town, into Central Windward canes


burnt in rancour and the production
fell, when we lost one hundred and odd
thousand dollars in revenue plus the
expense of keeping the policemen on
cuty there. Shouldn't the Minister for
Trade and Production now turn and
hang his head in shame and say let me
pay back by virtue of my experience,
now let me see if I can increase pro-
duction because I once destroyed it?
HON. E. T. JOSHUA: Mr. President, on
a-point of order, the Rules and Orders
of this Council say that no member of
this House should impute improper
motive to another member. The mem-
ber for South Leeward is saying here
and causing it to be recorded in Han-
sard that Joshua, calling his office, was
responsible for the burning of canes
and that is wrong. That is imputing
improper motives.
Mr. PRESIDENT: I was not aware that
the Honourable Member had actually
said that you were responsible.
HON. H. F. YOUNG: I did not say that
he was responsible for the burning of
canes.
HON. E. T. JOSHUA: You directly said
that that was so.
Mr. PRESIDENT: I am afraid I did not
hear that, I repeat.
HON. H. F. YOUNG: Would you like to
hear what I said?
Mr. PRESIDENT: NO, no, I will like you
to continue.
HON. H. F. YOUNG: The sped arrow
is past, the spoken word, ..... We
go on Sir. Is .that the line of produc-
tion? And right now in the constit-
uency where the peasantry which he
represents I would have thought that
from virtue of his portfolio that this
estimate, as I get back to the point, I
woula have seen some difference, some
peasant organisation as I have seen in
Antigua-a wonderful set up where you
have a peasant organisation where Gov-








ernment actually loan or rent them
plots or offer them money as loans to
produce, and take it back after their
crops are reaped. I have seen again,
Sir, that the cotton that grows in An-
tigua, the Marketing Department take
it co-operatively for the people and sell
it to the ginnery as a separate concern,
and in so doing they have actually got
31 cents per Ib. in Antigua, when their
lint is inferior to ours. When they got
$1.16 in the United Kingdom, we got
$1.44 and we still got 31 cents per.lb.
for our cotton. The difference of 28
cents would have been an incentive to
the peasants. I would like the Minister
for Trade and Production, Sir, to go
into these things and see to them, and
by doing that, our peasants would be
encouraged to continue to grow and
produce because we are purely agricul-
tural. I would like again, Sir, on the
question of the estimate, we are a fish-
eating people and the price of fish has
sky-rocketed in this country beyond the
means of the ordinary man. And the
money is not to the fishermen who
really deserve it, but it is going to a
middle man who takes the fish from
the fishermen. As Minister for Trade
and Production-by all means the price
of gear etc. has gone up. I was expect-
ing Sir, that this new Government
would have gone into the rights and
the economy of the people especially
the smaller people; but again I see
nothing is done. The budget is not a
scrap of paper, Mr. President, it must
be passed, the Government are in the
majority, I must follow on Mr. Presi-
dent. This estimate, whether I reject
it or not, must be passed. But I want
to say, Sir, that in passing this estimate,
which. must pass, because five is more
than four by one, and therefore it must
pass, but our people in St. Vincent es-
pecially the lower class of people have
been deceived. The money that has
been allocated to this estimate, whilst
it has been put, priority has not been
given to steer us along economic lines,
so that we can stop begging the Mother


Country and enter Federation strong.
What we are doing here is to create
posts and repair buildings. A Govern-
ment with a majority, I never expect
this Sir, from this Government. I ex-
pected to come here today to see this
Government turn this estimate com-
pletely different from what they thought
we were wrong in doing. Well now this
Government has fallen in line; and if
they can point out anything in that
estimate and tell me that they have
offered the people of St. Vincent, with
an increased budget as we have now,
I will resign my seat as a Member of
Council and give the P.P.P. another
vote. Mr. President, I am sorry r a
man. I am sorry for this Government.
And when I speak I don't expect all of
them to accept me because they are a
party they have a right. But I am very
sorry today around this table, because
when I saw the leader of this Govern-
ment for the last five years roaming
about in this country slandering the
Government, not only the Government
but the people of the General public 'of
St. Vincent by saying Sir, that they
were traitors. I never met and seen a
bigger traitor. And I am saying Sir,
that on that platform promises were
made to those same people who put this
Government into power. Today, Sir, a
deception has taken place. He has got
from them what he wanted and he has
reached where he wants to go, and all
the glowing speeches and all the slander
and all the promises that were made in
St. Vincent, now that they have reached
to a point that they should come out
and offer something back to those .
people he has failed in doing so. Mr.
President, when I go for lunch, which
I hope to get sometime, I am hoping
to study some more points which I have
forgotten. But I will go on to tell you
that unless this Government-and the
chance that this Government has in
fostering education, especially in trying
at least to see what they can do to edu-
cate the masses, not politically, we have
gone too far away from the education-


': \








al and economical stand-point. The
political power that has been given to
some of us have gone to our heads. We
have got now to a point, politically, but
what is going to happen in the next
twenty-five or thirty years to those
unfortunate people whom some of us-
politicians are fooling today? What
part are they going to play, Mr. Presi-
dent, in this young nation? What part
is this Government trying to play?
What efforts has this Government made
in this new estimate of theirs to start
to prepare us along for this new nation
in education and other lines? Mr.
President and Honourable Members the
great old Captain Cipriani used to say,
Sir, in his days-educate agitate and
federate. There is no need for agitation
now, there is no need for application
because in those dfys there was no
party government. We have seen the
British people, that great Common-
wealth of Nations have offered us con-
stitution even without asking; we have
seen that they have taken their money
and offered us for development of
schools etc. But we have seen this
Government who had got into power
by the masses, have not offered them
something in this estimate for the first
time. Mr. President, we have seen this
Commonwealth of nations, we have seen
the West Indies Federation come into
being. We have seen the constitution
change in Jamaica, in Barbados, we
have seen men like Manley and Grant-
ley Adams, Eric Williams. We have seen
in the new West Indies and the budget
of Trinidad recently, Eric Williams had
discussed to raise Revenue because he
realises that Trinidad must stand on
its legs in the Federation. We have
seen that he raises the revenue on the
other side, a development programme,
on the other side of the revenue and
expenditure side we havp seen a hous-
ing scheme, a roads scheme, and all
kinds of schemes to lift the economy
of the country. I am not vexed with
the Financial Secretary. I work for
him and I find him very honest and
straight forward. He has presented a


budget, he has tried and I think he
should know more than me that if in
this estimate and I would like to know
if in this estimate, in this draft esti-
mate, there, is anything different made
by this new Government for the eco-
nomic development of this country, if
there is, I will manly resign from this
House. In 1956 we had $60,000 for
maintenance of roads. In 1957 the Ex-
Minister and Mr. Baynes went to the
United Kingdom and it was increased
$120,000. At that time, Sir, they started
the interior Feeder roads, the Farm road
to Mesopotamia and the road to Bucca-
ment Valley; but the nev Government
have come, Sir, and have just fallen in
line by adding a few thousands more
to feeder roads, by paving the walls,
buying a new jeep. That is all we
have seen Inside this estimate-buying
a new launch, repairing buildings, but
they have not offered one scheme, in
this estimate for the beloved people who
put them there. I was very glad when
the Financial Secretary quoted that
our part in the Federation would Le
about $60,000, and for your informa-
tion, Mr. President that is why I am
very much interested in this affair.
Jamaica $2,175,000, Trinidad and Tobago
$2,413,000 Barbados $463,000, Grenada
$49,000 St. Vincent $41,000. In joining
this Federation you can see that Federa-
tion as it stands, our bigger brothers
like Jamaica and Trinidad are actually
bearing the burden, and since this has
reached the West Indian spirit and all
that feeling of pride that we all look
forward to, so that when we travel in
the outer world we would be called West
Indians and not British objects or Brit-
ish subjects. Now it is time for this
Government, this little dole that we
have to put into this new nation of ours
-we find into this new estimates no
economic development, no development
for our education so that we will always
be grant-aided and have to depend on
our West Indian brothers. Let us as-
sume, Sir, that the British Government
will give us some money, some people
say that for years they have no sugar.






S30


and it is reciprocal. Some people say
that we are forced to buy their goods or
else-and that is economic from an eco-
nomical point, so what they give we
have to be thankful for. I didn't say
that but we are going to join the West
Indian Federation as a nation and need
our brothers to depend upon, what ale
they going to think of us? What step is
this Government in its embryo stage
,where history is accomplished, with a
full-fledged party Government and with
Federation just a few months, what
have they offered in the name of heaven
in this estimate to bear up and stop
begging our Trinidad and Jamaica
brothers. Our grant from the English
Parliament will soon be stopped. They
were crucified and called Imperialists-
Imperial stooges, those were the words,
but now they are not stooges any more,
Mr. President, and I am standing here
as a Member of the Opposition, Her
Majesty's most loyal Opposition, as a
Member of the British Cc.anoonwealth,
as a man who respects la- and Order,
as a man who wants to see a West
Indian nation, but still will not kick
down the British way of life. And this
'tint of red' Government under disguise
has always opposed. Now he has not
offered any schemes for development,
educationally economically or otherwise
for the people who followed him.
If we go on like this, Mr. President-
dont think about the time now, I am
going to go on; you all are getting
hungry. The point is (ve will have to
spend more on the police, and if we
stop thinking of our youths, we will
have to spend more on the prisons, and
by spending more on prisons we are
deteriorating. We will never get out in
that way. If we go into our valleys and
start fixing our roads, Mr. President, if
we see the amount of Crown Lands that
are lying idle away in the bush and give
it to the poor man who can work it to
help himself and to help the boy and
girl to become a man and woman; then
you will be assisting this island and
eventually you will be assisting the


police because a hungry man always
flares up quicker than a man who is,
economically strong.
We go further, we ha e the Grena-
dines: TouriSt Developnent, fishery
Scheme-we have $10,000 last year to be
given to fishermen, nothing was done.
This is not new as I heard him say, Mr.
President, that they have voted over a
thousand dollars for the fishery scheme.
There was always a.fishery scheme cur-
rently existing, but the machinery was
not working. Everything was hinged on
the Agricultural Department. Some-
times they called meetings; my friend
here knows that. There was a woman,
Mr. President, at Clare Valley whose
seine went to pieces and even though
she sent application here to assist nor
with gears from that same vote for the
fisherman and I recall that, but loans
to fisherman is not the problem. What
is the problem is the new methods: new
types of gears, co-operative marketing,
by just giving them the money like that,
train them along the new methods of
catching fish, we still have in the old
french way of catching fish. Money can
be spent, and in grabbing here, take the
Minister for Social Services, Sir, and he
grabs here, and he is quite right that we
have increased. Who has better ser-
vices, Sir? Who can stand here and
say not to have our hospital or to in-
crease the pay of tie nurses, or to give
more beds to the hospital? How wonder-
ful! But if we aon't continue to develop
our economy and i we don't continue
to educate we woull never have enough
beds in our hospitals. It is ignorance,
it is poverty that makes people sick.
And you would do more by spending
on their children by giving them lands
to work, by assisting them with fertil-
izer, than to spend it on the hospital
because you try to educate and event-
ually you teach them more hygiene then
they could take care of themselves.
When that child becomes a mother and
can then inculcate what she has learnt,
she will be able to keep out of hospital.
Much money is spent because of lack


/ i .* A 4I.i,:l.:r HL-L .iJLc.. eI. .aii-h a


ih*X 'i








of proper management, lack of proper
"know-how"-that is what I thought
this Government right have started.
I don't expect them not for one moment
to accomplish overnight, but I thought
this new Government in power, Sir,
would have made an effort along the
education lines, along develop;;-.ent so
that this new nation of ours, this little
spot of earth, we are not mysterious as
he has stated, I have been to Jamaica
and I have seen ignorant people in
Jamaica just like people in St. Vincent;
they are not superior. There are a
million and a half in Barbados, and not
because we are small, but I say Sir, we
are one cf the best little spots compar-
atively speaking, an,; as I said we have
more breadfruit, we have mrango, we
have an abundance of vegetables, we
are not the worst off. If you go to
Antigua you will see pure cotton ana
pure cane. If you g;o to Barbados you
will see pure cane. St. Vincent even
export cattle, ground provisions-pota-
toes, yams, peanuts, copra and our big
staple products-cotton and arrowroot
and now bananas. But with all St. Vin-
cent production, St. Vincent is going to
pieces. Back here are the poor girls
*who are having children without prop-
er homes for them- back here is the
whole bunch of illegitimacy going on-
fathers not supporting their children;
back here, is the social problem very
serious in the country where fathers
shirk their responsibility and the poor
mother-s have to go in the field to work
and leave one child to take care of
another child. And those c lildren are
to be the new nation. Back here I
am asking this Government to find a
thatched roof to put tlem in and edu-
cate them in some form. But instead
of dqing that a whole big upkeep of
buildings and all kinds of white wash,
instead of working along those lines
so that when those poor people leave
that field they have no means of im-
proving their children. There are many
in the field working for the task, but
they don't even kfiow how to measure


it. You know how many of them, Sir,
they don't even know how to check
their weight on the scale. Do you know
Sir, that if you would educate them in
the small way, Sir, even to sign their
names, how many people have sent
money from England now, Sir and their
people have to get someone to sign their
names. Are we going to be satisfied
Sir that we are beginning a new nation
and are taking no interest in our
people? And then when we become a
nation Sir, a nation of what? A nation
with a public half inside of school and
half outside of school-people who still
cant understand. And I will say so that
the economy of any country lies in the
development of its people. Mr. Presi-
dent, I maintain what I am going to
say, and I believe that I am capable of
finding words. Again I am going to
tell you if you believe I am going to
get worn out, I am going to stay until
night and a glass of water will feed me.
The great Master will keep me. We go
on to say this time is not five and six
years; it is five and six years that this
Government have been slandering this
island. It is five or six years Mr. Presi-
dent, that this Government in order
to get in power have used the mental-
ity of our people to put themselves here,
and having got into power, Mr. Presi-
dent, again I go over it they have failed
in the estimates to offer them some-
thing. We have seen Mr. President,
that the fallen Executive Mimber is
the Leader of this Government now.
We have seen that his political man-
oevering that 1-e was able to leave his
seat at North Windward and the.people
followed him so much that he was able
to leave his constituency and say that
his wife will take it and go into another
constituency. How wonderful! I have
nothing to do with that. It shows a
wonderful following. But history re-
cords itself Mr. President. When this
time of history should ripe itself I won-
der if it will bear the fruit. Ah! time
will tell. I want to see what will hap-
pen.


*








This Honourable House has also made
.history by having the first lady as our
Councillor. I think it is a very sorry
thing. I think the Leader has done a
lot for the other women of St. Vincent,
and I fail to make a compliment. But
I wish the Leader, Mr. President, will
search his mind, and after searching
his mind find out if he has done the
right thing for this Island. I leave the
matter to him. Now this constituency
the two sections of North Windward
and Central Windward, Mr. President,
this Leader will have to realise and
think, and I hope the Member for North
Windward will not think-especially a
lady, I am very much respectful to you,
and I am not trying to say anything
against you, so I want to make this
quite clear and I must, the voice of the
people who have put you there, I am
speaking to the Leader. Therefore, Mr.
President, in trying to explain that, I
hope that the Honourable Member for
North Windward would not think that
I am throwing words at her.
We go a little further, and the reason
Sir, why I must talk is that the official
portfolio in which my friend is holding
-the Minister for Communications and
Works, an experienced job; the Minister
for Social Services, quite alright, they
have their nose there they suppose to
carry on; but Mr. President, the Min-
ister must think and plan so that he
can carry on the development of his
country.

Mr. PRESIDENT: I think it will clarify
the- debate slightly if the Honourable.
Member would be seated for a moment.
Mr. Young is going over and over again,
it will clarify the debate considerable
if I explain that development cannot
be in the budget. If we are debating
the budget the word development should
be left out of this totally. I now ad-
journ the House of its sitting for a
moment.


(House adjourned at 1.05 p.m.)

House Resumed at 3.45 pm..

Mr. PRESIDENT: I now call on the
Honourable Member for South Leeward
to continue.

HON. H. F. YOUNG: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, again we have the
Agricultural under Expenditure Head 4
on page 30, I see in our Estimate con-
tribution towards Camden Park Experi-
ment station $13,000 Purchase of Land
Rover $4,000. Sometime ago, when I
was a Member of the former Govern-
ment and these heads of Department
used to taste and feel that it is all well
in the development of the Country.
Sometime ago there was a land rover
which was used by the officer for his
personal purpose. I don't know who is
going to use this one, Mr. President, I
cant see why $13,100 is given to Camden
Park. We are purely agricultural and
we have to be interested in agriculture.
I think the Leader of the Government,
in all fairness to what happen this
morning, would agree with me that if
I say this, that if services are put into
this estimate that do not reach the
people then they are useless; and when
I say this I do not mean to bring to his
notice this amount of contribution for
Camden Park. Camden Park is set up
by C.D. & W. and during the early days
of no less a person Sir, than Mr. Robin-
son, and you have to take in question
the days of Mr. Garvey, the Agricultural
Experiment developed St. Vincent from
a little set up at the back of the Gram-
mar School throughout the length and
breath 'of this country. Unlike the
other department, Education etc. he
stole the picture, a very good thing. This
purpose is alright. The British Govern-
ment came here and they built at Cam-
den Park a structure that I believe was
too heavy and. too big especially the








buildings in this poor island. The estate
is too large to experiment. A certain
portion can be used for experiment but
the other portion should be given-we
succeeded in cutting another portion
from the estate at Camden Park; but
every year instead of this with the pro-
duction of bananas, sea island cotton,
what are we getting now? We are
getting a Government having lands
where the Agricultural Experiment De-
partment is suppose to assist the peas-
ants in producing more, instead he is
occupying his own estate, picking his
own mangoes, picking all, and the Gov-
ernment has no control over them.
When the time should be spent to pro-
pogate knowledge and to assist in the
production, his time is spent in his
own plot of land owned by Government,
where he- is using. Is that the purpose
of the Agricultural Experiment Depart-
ment? We go forward we get the potato
vine, right! and the average man can
not afford to experiment then they
grow their vine there and after they
prove it is there thosA potatoes are too
weak, then the vine will die. Now do
we get the cassava that they experiment
to go to our peasants? No. Then the
whole thing based on the disseminate
fact and after a while instead of help-
ing the community eventually you have
to get some kind of white elephant.
Who is going to use this land rover and
why are we still adding to this white
elephant. The production in St. Vin-
cent today has reached to a point where
the planter, whether he is large or
small, and I will go further to say that
not one of these agricultural officers
apart I must differ with the contour.
The contouring of the land in St. Vin-
cent is a credit, the soil; but apart from
that the dissemination of knowledge to
our peasants whose main livelihood is
agriculture I am still thinking could
not recommend. We reach to a point
now where sometimes they used to say
strangers are coming in here; they are
not strangers any more they are West
Indians. All those sons of the soil in


position refuse to come back to their
country instead of loving their country,
and some of those agricultural officers
do not even know the interior of the
island.
Last year in our estimates, and this
is no blow against the government I
examined the estimates a thousand
times for its definition. I have seen in-
cluded here some two thousand pounds.
The emphasis on agriculture is a point
we could never stop; it creates an in-
centive, and even in Canada, even in
the United States where they are high-
ly industrialized they still have the
agricultural zones. Last year the Agri-
cultural Department failed to put out
any shows. I am asking you Mr. Min-
ister for Trade and Production to see
that a show is put on so that the man
who rear his chickens and his goats
and grow his yams etc. can make an
exhibit: And not only in agriculture but
handwork etc., a general exhibit to show
what we can do in St. Vincent. From
that we are going to assist the poor
people of St. Vincent. To end up I am
going to quote his Honour in saying-
"Honourable Members, in earlier
years the President has delivered his
Budget Address knowing that all Un-
official Members really regard them-
selves as the Opposition. Last year,
he delivered it knowing that although
he spoke largely on his own part, and
still bad a Government prepared to
support its own budget there was an
Opposition ready to "walk stick" on
his address."
Therefore Your Honour, if I told this
House in quoting your own words, I
stand here today as an Opposition op-
posing this Government constructively,
for and on behalf of this Island es-
pecially as we are approaching a new
nation. And in ending up, the Opposi-
tion is always in the minority, and I
hope the Government will take note of
that, that speech of mine is construc-
tive, and I hope in the future that even
though some of the things may be in-







cluded in this estimate, they have power
in the Executive Council when they sit
upon them, they can raise some of the
money and put it to other use. Your
Honour, Members of this Government,
I wish you God speed and hope you will
stay in time to do things for St. Vin-
cent.

HoN. E. T. JOSHUA: Mr. President,
Honourable Members of this Honour-
able House, the gallery has gone, but
records of Hansard will remain indeli-
bly written in this House. You were
listening to the tirade in the Legisla-
tive Council in the form of what you
must call an opposition directed and
levelled at one man in this House. You
have been listening to something un-
precedented in the history of our local
Parliament, a rowdy, rebellious, pick-
ing to pieces, and illogical tact, out of
proportion, and just a tale told by an
idiot full of sound and fury signifying
nothing. We have been listening to an
abolition that is apt to disgrace this
House in that when we take the Hansard
of this debate today you will find irrele-
vacty, meandering, and a set of ravel
going round and round, believing a sort
of misrepresentations and unproven and
the rest, I am not rising here as what
is well earned today, the Leader of .the
Government, not to fall in that pitfall.
Really I have to congratulate the Fin-
ancial Secretary for what facts he had
at his disposal, what with the staff in
London, and snow, to have here after
having well argued many a night in
London in the cold with blankets over
us, still we were advised by the British
Government not to argue about stip-
ends that must balance our budget.
How uncharitable the Member for South
Leeward appear after disclose that he
knows so well, he that knows the facts
and doeth it not shall be beaten with
many stripes. I believe he is meander-
ing about Parliamentary facts when he
looks at the opposition if he had any
sense of proportion and honour in the
face of what he said, you will see how


unreasonable he was for accusing us for
not having added all sorts of emolu-
ments to the budget when he knows
that the strict decree of the Treasury
Officials of London today that we have
nothing new, but we are prepared to-
wage arguments so that services in the
Colony may be continued. He knows
also that we can't come first this year
from the fact that we are Treasury-
controlled; he also noted the fact and
laid stress on Camden Park and what
was more dishonestly made a mirage of
stipends increase of 20% to Ministers,
but if this House will hear the facts
surrounding that, I wonder if he can
hold his head high up again and call
himself an opposition. The 20% increase
was engineered by the last Government
and at the time when it was done they
were afraid to do anything about it until
they know the position of coming back
here in this House, so after having failed
to come back here this is what is true,
the Secretary of State by their own cap-
tion had agreed to increase it and I be-
lieve and I can tell you what I discov-
ered and let me put before this House;
the fact of this 20% increase, they have
had it fixed, cut and dry, they have had
it retrospective from the 1st January
and the Secretary of State approved it,
but the unexpected happened or you
would have heard a different tune and
song by the same Member with the loyal
Opposition in this House today; you
would have heard something different.
The very budget preliminary-that is to
say the estimates that he was going
through clause by clause that he was
actually going from department to de-
partment he never did any estimate, he
never showed his nose anywhere about,
but stayed away then he would have
known the true significance of the 20%
increase. But after he had not even
attended to pay respect to the seat of
honour to the Finance Committee meet-
ing, at this time he would have known
and not have to come here to state
irrelevant facts to the people in the
gallery. That wouldn't help him in any








way, it wouldn't give him a vote extra.
In dealing now with this 20% increase
you know what happen: The Secretary
of State said yes I am going to agree to
the 20% increase for the Ministers and
that it would come to Legislative Coun-
cil what form the Legislative Council
would have taken would have been
known to the Honourable Member had
he attended the ordinary Finance Com-
mitte Meeting, he should have been
able to have some knowledge, but he
didn't want that. He wanted to come
here in this House with a set of irrele-
vant statements to test their imagina-
tion of the people who didn't know
better because it is true he is weaving
a tangled web when he practise to de-
ceive. Deception is well known from
that Honourable Gentleman, and no
wonder today he has come and offered
them 20% increase like the dog in the
manger, dogs don't eat hay; but he has
offered to check an angle of getting
20% increase in any form whatsoever;
so he comes and tells you that the new
Government has increased their salary
when he know nothing about it. When
the Secretary of State asked when
should that salary be paid he said the
1st October. He could have given the
Colonial Secretary fully well knowing
the responsibility that it incurred. And
I will tell the public this we are not
here to have corroboration, we are not
here to have meeting that allocate to
profit or gain. That is the story pure
and simple of the 20% increase. He
had hoped to get back there and* he
hasn't, and now the monkey hasn't
asked for an increase but if the Secre-
tary of State thought it fit and proper
to arm us sufficiently to get a car where
we want-walk, because the constitu-
ency is not a mere constituency spoken
so often .around this Table, so long as
this is in my constituency, it is going
to every part of the island that he can
see how-as an experienced minister,
well if I am inexperienced who is ex-
perienced? I am inexperienced well
then I can write books of their in ex-


perience. When I hear the Honourable
Member for South Leeward speaking on
education I believe it makes every extra
nervous fibre walk in me. Who gives
him the authority to speak. Fools and
idiots walk in where angels fear to
tread.
Now the Camden Park Experiment
Station concerns Agriculture. It was
just three months that the Government
is in power but remember if everything
that was said, remember he said that if
Government could make bricks out of
straw could be vine and to ask the Sec-
retary of State not for one million three
hundred thousand dollars but for five,
million three thousand dollars when he
knows full well that it is impossible.
They asked, the St. Lucian delegation
argued, and many of the things that
were cut out of the St. Lucia estimate
by special act of grace were accorded
us. The question of teaching, he was
speaking of the deficiency of the Educa-
tion Department because seven hundred
thousand dollars is for teaching, he has
heard how the money is built up; it was
built up from the coppers of the Treas-
ury in England. The Minister for Com-
munications and Works and myself all
night from 2 o'clock to three in the
morning have been fixing figures for
coppers in a proper manner. The quer-
ies of the Under Secretary of State and
Mr. Fairclough of the Colonial Office
to gauge a right sum to cover all the
aspects of the increase. May I ask
what more we have done to educate.
Transfer is directly a local matter; we
in England did not know anything. And.
that has nothing to do with it-a mul-
tiple and uncharitable opposition just
merely trying to ridicule and trying to
deride where praises should go. The
question of the Agricultural Department
at Camden Park, he fully knows that
"the Honourable Member of the Opposi-
tion, they who had it first to deal with.
When we hear an Opposition raise his
voice he cements it stronger and Gov-
ernment does not act in a shelter skelter
manner as the Member for South Lee-








ward try to make it out this morning.
It is carried on-if all of us here drop
dead at this moment the Government will
go on. One who presently arriving will
telephone to another about the disaster,
an act over which he has no control, a
nominated council will be able to carry
on the democracy, and the Member of
the Opposition knows this. Whatever
was done in the past Government is'
the policy; one which could be imple-
mented must be carried out, so if Cam-
den Park-the white elephant now to
him who prided himself in times past
the Minister without portfolio he must
,know this that it is just his policy like
you press an electric button and you
get current until that current again is
broken by switching off, and when we
implement policy in the Government it
can't so easily be switched when schemes
are prepared, so therefore Mr. Opposi-
tion is hearing the echo of his own
voice on what he has spoken already.
The spoken wold the neglected oppor-
tunity, the sped arrow and the time
past could never be taken back. But
while he played to the gallery no gallery
is here now; but as a Council in a bud-
get debate, I am clearing up certain
points of mischief which were meant
to misdirect this Honourable House this
morning.
You would have noticed that men-
tion was made of transport for Leeward
and that transport was criticized sevece-
iy and unduly by the Member for the
opposition. He tells us now that Her
Majesty's mail can no longer be taken
in a dignified manner to Leeward, but
we must go and get industrial engin-
eers in some form or the other. He
knows that there is a precedence set in
the Windward even he who is affected
by it would not think that our mail
should continue to go along in this. A
van was made to carry mail to the Lee-
ward coast it was just because it was
only the counter part on the Leeward
coast.
Now may I digress a little and go to
the facts of the estimate: In the Agri-


cultural Department which comes un-
der the portfolio of the Minister for
Trade and Production a most inex-
perienced Minister, he speaks of the
increase of personal emolumennts of
about seventeen thousand dollars and
in the overall picture of the Agricul-
tural Department there is an increase of
thirty-seven thousand dollars ($37,000).
That was not put there like a white
washed pillar-certainly not. That
money was placed there for services.
The very complaints made in this House
and sometimes you hear voices screem-
ing about Agricultural Officers or in the
old lacatan fields of Bananas that the;
are not going to see the work of tie
Government to further the ends cl tne
people, and now all that as if ile had
drunken of the Waters of Lethe and
forgot our sorrows overnight that we
cannot remember anything the Mem-
ber for the Opposition comes here now
to tell us fairy long tales of opposition
that directs itself towards having Agri-
cultural Officers working for themselves.
The Agricultural Department so far as
the increase lies, goes in personal emol-
uments, and there was need for a land
rover for the purpose of getting an offi-
cer of the Agricultural Department
special men to go to supervise these
points; not the Minister leaving and
going to the forest there is much more
valuable work to be done. The time
will come to visits projects and to go
and see major schemes and roads; but
he has more in the scheme of things
than merely going out to do the work
of an agricultural officer in a land
rover. If we trust people we get the
maximum benefit out of them. If we
do adopt the policy of the Member of
the Opposition just to hound down
people and see them plant two lacatan
banana in their backyard or carrying
bunches of bananas, we will get no
where. The question now is the land-
rover; the purpose of a landrover which
the Honourable Member of the Opposi-
tion knows too well. He speaks of
houses in which people are living at
Lot 8, the moonlight can be seen on








them at night because of those badly
cut lumber and hurry manner in which
those houses were done; perhaps it was
the political scheme and that's all.
Hospital at Georgetown: That is a
very important point, I am glad that
the Honourable Member of the Opposi-
tion raised it I would have given any
other points in here this evening if he
had any sense at all, that one I would
have never touched at all. It is known
that the present Superintendent of
Public Works had his surveyors had
plans made and everything cut and dry
to see that the second town of import-
ance in the country should have a bet-
ter means at least for the protection of
the people but what has happened he
himself was surprised to know that the
old government cut it out and didn't
care. They knew the plan of discrim-
ination against the constituency, they
were constituent Government-a Gov-
ernment who thought of constituency
to show people that they are doing
something put some water here, a bulb
there. This Government is not a con-
stituency type of Government. You are
right, Mr. President, the Opposition
was right when they said that this
Government wduld think of the country
as a wnole because we know of no con-
stituency, we know of a School Build-
ing Programme within the angle of the
Colonial Development and Welfare funds
that is the only way a new school can
be set up in the Colony because it took
one million three hundred thousand
dollars from the Colonial Office in Lon-
don to balance the 'amount that has
fallen short in taxes. We have not
embark here on a tax crazy programme.
If we had done that to get the one
million three hundred thousand dollars
the opposition would have been singing
another tune here to the gallery but we
haven't done that. Everything will come
in time because this Island going into
a Federation the people who are well-
to-do or who could afford to give would
not, but when they give they give for
the perfection of their own country In


such a crucial time of our history there-
fore we have not embarked on a crazy
tax venture but we have actually shown
out the Colonial Office that we have
fallen short of the amount that will
run our Administration and that we are
now come here to argue the salient and
important point that you will give us
the vital thing tnat will complete a
budgetary consideration for the island
of St. Vincent, they have done so. Never
before-I must now be personal and
make special reference to the Minister
for Communications and Works. I re-
member in Shakespeare Merchant of
Venice when Portia of Belmont was told
by Shylock who wanted a pound of
flesh from the Merchant's bossom 'How
much older art thou than thy looks'.
He used double comparative for the
purpose of emphasis and brevity. How
much older is the Minister for Com-
munications than when side by side
with the Financial Secretary ne had
reached the expectation of not only
those who know him in the West Indies,
but the dignitaries and agents of the
Colonial Office. They never heard a
man spoke so well in their native
language and for that much he was
appreciated, because he made no belief
and his figures were superb. Never be-
fore had a delegation-there was no
great putting on. We talk in propor-
tion. We talk so much as to get what-
ever amount we have got, and we are
pleased to say to all this morning it is
the highest grant-in-aid that has ever
been given to this country. We are not
proud of the fact to have grant-in-aid
but what will we do? If we were to get
one million dollars by taxation our
heads will be off. Then the Minister
the one without portfolio, now in the
opposition would then have some thing
to say which I regard in no mistaken
term, anyone with any intelligence
could say that the debate this morning
v as coherence sensible and logical. It
was a meandering designate to a tirade
on the Minister for Trade and Produc-
tion extolling the gallery and inex-


a, A...






38


perience; but we will like Mr. President,
to inform the Opposition that it was
taken in spirit. If he- that knows not
and knows not that he knows not is a
fool, shun him; but he that knows not
and knows that he knows not is a wise
man, teach him; he will learn. I am
offered to think that we have had some
amusement this morning though it
sound hard in that a Government just
assume power just a few weeks ago,
that this Government should have had
schemes, should have so developed by
taxation extra revenue so that we could
get big schemes, perhaps laying down
a cement factory, perhaps bring a shirt
factory here, float loans for building
houses, float loans for building second-
S ary schools and the rest, when the op-
position fully well know that we ate
grant-aided and they have asked us-
our greatest sphere I have seen the
Officer administering the Government
is told that might be considered some
new project that might be regarded as
something new an improvement, we only
have to retain our ordinary status in
economy. That has moved me because
something should be done so that we
can be able to hold our heads high and
should be able to raise sufficient money
to run our country. That does not mean
anything to the Opposition especially
when they want to be unfair. A wicket
was passed this morning that when
in Roman time you hold a Christian
from one of the provinces, lashed him
to a tent post and begin to beat him
as if he has committed an offence. That
is the type of Opposition that was
passed here this morning. But I must
congratulate the Minister for Communi-
cations and Works, you have given a
good job. To the Minister, Mr. Presi-
dent through you, the Minister for Com-
munications and Works and the Minister
for Social Services have done a good
job. My portfolio was more than the
Member thinks, and if he never studied
economics he never went to a school of
economics, how could he judge who is
experienced or inexperienced to be a


Minister for Trade and Production. He
doesn't even know the qualification of
the Minister for Trade and Production.
He did not know, but just for the bene-
fit of attack because he has a mouth'
and a -big one at that.
The question now arises-not merely
the Agricultural Departmeat-there was
a severe drought in British Guiana and
we aie now on our toes with the ques-
tion of rice. The rice problem is food
for the common man, because there is
a tendency now to plant the whole of
of St. Vincent in bananas without
thinking. The time will come when we
must retain some food for local con-
sumption, then the brain is hot when
we have to think of where our rice
supply will come from when food is cut
off completely. We have to think of
that rice. We have to work out in pro-
portion whether or not the mooraging
to be paid to ships landing rice can be
retained, whether or not the price will
rise or the price will remain the same.
It takes intelligence; only if the Mem-
ber of the Opposition wants to say that
the Minister for Trade and Production
has no education nor Intelligence.
Therefore it takes just a stereotype
form of knowledge in general with the
three "R's" and beyond that a good
secondary education to understand what
it is to keep a Ministry going; and above
all honesty and sincerity to the. Gov-
ernment under which we work and the
people of that colony or that island.
In those things a man must first judge
himself. I have jur ed myself and
purge my conscience and know that
those qualities are given to me from
which after the Ruler of this Universe
question me I shall not easily Aepart.
The question is that we can't make
bricks out of straw, and we can't make
miracles but the present state of this
island can only be relieved by a tax
crazy move as that now in Trinidad, so
that they can raise the amount of
money to cover the disabilities of this
island; and it is already said that tax-
ation has reached saturation point.


i '








When the press represents an act the
people who never came in this Legisla-
tive Council Chamber to listen to even
a debate, you will think-well said, well
spoken. It is like a statement that
exist like this-Macbeth said in a letter
to his wife 'we ought not to murder
Duncan' which amounts to a mean-
ingless set of expression. That last
statement has -no meaning. A million
things said here by the Opposition this
morning are not only tales told by an
idiot but meaningless expression signi-
fying nothing. We know the facts that
the impossibilities that confront this
island it takes the twelve labours of
Hercules to pursue a course to bring
redemption to our country. And of
course the moment you attempt to tax,
the best lawyers present themselves
here to defend those taxes. As soon as
you start to talk about Income Tax you
find a scowl is over the face, and then
the whole Government is no good. What
that money is being applied for? It is
Being applied for the things that the
opposition spoke of this morning. It
can't be done with half-a-plate, it must
be done with money. The rate of in-
terest at the marketing price is 7%.
7% per annum as the Minister for Social
Services said, and that will mean that
the interest alone we must pay to float
new projects would be so dismal and
great and we already have a bank over-
draft ominously heavy enough at Bar-
clays Bank. That is the position that
faces the Government and the people
should know it.
The question of Canada is another
very important point. Some time ago,
the very leader if I might say so, I do
not think I am hurting the Member for
the Grenadines whom I know to be the
Head of the Opposition, but I can say
the Leader of the Opposition who show
himself so this morning not in decorum
but verbosity. He said he once spoke
in the Jamaican papers, New York Tri-
bune and the rest made a remark; but
we today who hold our heads high when
the Governor-General pass through, we


hail him our first Governor-General; if
we were to attack the speech made in
Canada by that Member cf the Opposi-
tion what would he say? He was firing
sparks without knowing what he was
saying. Nationhood-the big brother can
take the small one an annexture to it
after decreasing treason in the New
World.
The question of dictatorship uttered
by the Opposition this morning sur-
prised me, because if that was so-if I-
had been ruling the Member who spoke
in the Opposition this morning, he
would not quite deceive me; that shows
liberal Democratic views. If a man has
the idea to serve his people and he likely
to deceive one that he has the inclina-
tion to do otherwise, his blood is in his
own hands. He has had every oppor-
tunity, and the Leader, first thing he
tried to defy this morning, and tot.ay
the last breadfruit is left. Federal hon-
ours and Federal stipends is more con-
venient to the Opposition. So that
being so now our public at one time
some body tried to fool and feel in the
dark by making verbose and meaning-
less expression in this House. Flowery
speeches in the gallery to defile the
Leader of a party who has just come into
office and who proposed to carry out
certain commitments of Government
that are already here, in so far that
they have already been crystalised into
schemes and projects so the rising of
them or the falling of them is a matter
for this Government, and the Honour-
able opposition knows that. Oh what 'a
tangled web we weave when we practice
to deceive. We have understanding and
most of the people we try to tell in
speeches and glowing gallery gossips,
they know the truth, and more so than
he who speaks, they know the character
of the man who speaks and modus
operandi et that is the job accomplished
in a nutshell when we have in a com-
pany understanding people. You can-
not fool people all the tme like that;
you think you can, and when you think
you can fool people there is where we


.~ -1.








make .the mistake. This Canadian busl-
ness is the only point I can stress on
because it is important. Knowledge of
Trade and Production-no knowledge.
I remember that a minister of this coun-
try once leaving here and went to
Loncon-I must propose to make men-
tion of that-and a lot of economic
experts with their Ph.D. B.Sc. met and a
statement was made to those learned
gentlemen of economics and other
social science that St. Vincent was self-
contained. You didn't want a knowledge
of economics neither did you want to be
a Minister of Trade and Production to
know what self-contained means. One
of them pointed out that if St. Vincent
is self-contained why Treasury control.
The voice of course was silent because it
was Ph.D. (Econ). speaking and one who
knew better. That was a fairy land!
tale; of course we know reality and fact.
But it is the Member who may have no
experience. Time alone will prove
whether it is mere idle talk or actual
fact of experience or intellect that will
determine what the ability of the Min-
ister is. Ben Hur was in the fountain
when the Roman soldiers snatched and
rubbed the dust of the earth where the
water dripped so that he c.uld not suck
the sand but an unknown hand came
and dipped in that water and gave the
noble prince to drink so that he sur-
vived quite beyond a number of diffi-
culties. I have survived, and it is for
me to step at the tenets of right reason
to the right. Use what you have at
your disposal so that the country might
benefit from it. And I pray the whole
of this universe that I should never be
caught in partiality-that thing which
I suffered for many years as a lone voice
crying in the Opposition.
Mr. President, I must give you a word
of good cheer and compliment. It is
that if I didn't do that the tables, mace
and papers will cry out. I have listened
to you very carefully in all your delib-
erations even before you briefed us in
going to London. We have acted upon
most of the points you have given us.


You seem to know the way these people
strike when you bring-up points to them
for money. We have acted on most of
them and they worked. You have-done
your part. Whatever we get we hope
to do our part. Those constituencies
that have things hanging as soon as we
are able to clear what is in the fire now
we will have them attended to. Of
course it is no use trying to describe
the Government that it did not work;
it has just begun to work. By-doing
that you were so chilled like throwing
cold water in a pot of boiling water
with food cooking it hardens the food
because the two natures of the water
do not blend. The Financial Secretary,
I am satisfied that he did his part in
London. Many a time he saw me des-
pondent even though I was listening to
the television after work was done.
With regards to the Opposition I will
just say let bygones be bygones, and I
say, Mr. President, we shall use what-
ever funds we have at our disposal to
make this country a new and happy
place in the Federation.

HON. C. L. TANNIs: Mr. President,
and Honourable Members of this House,
I arise to throw light on the debate of
this budget for 1958. Of course I hope
during my debate I would not hurt the
sentiments or feelings of the Members
of this House or even the President,
but I will attempt to touch on a few
points in the budget. I listened to two
great speeches in this House this morn-
ing followed by the speeches of the able
Ministers of Government, and I thought
that after lunch I would sit down and
keep quiet. But the leader of this Gov-
ernment touched- a few points which
gave rise to my standing here this after-
noon. As a member of the former Gov-
ernment the statements made by the
Minister to the effect that the standard
of this House now is worst. How deep
was the surprise when I looked on the
budget for 1958. There appeared very
little difference to what it wag the last
year. He followed the same pattern,
and I heard the Government here this


.1.. ~.








morning blowing its own music and
dance. Last year the delegation for the
first time went to London in 1957, but
of course never got on with that the
people got on with now when the dele-
gation returned with only two hundred
thousand dollars in excess of what was
achieved in the last year, and then they
get up in this Government and say the
foundation was laid by the delegation
that went up in 1957. And when I lis-
ten to the Leader of the Government
and the Honourable Minister for Com-
munications and Works to what they
have done without which not one single
thing would have been done this after-
noon, I then have to agree with the
former Member of the Opposition that
the Government has not achieved any-
thing new to present to this House.
I did not expect the Government to
achieve everything. Perhaps in time to
come they would. How many of us can-
not put what we want to say in good
language. The Member for South Lee-
ward criticized the Government in what
the Government has failed to do, and
if the Government took it in good light
and whatever we believe took place this
morning has given this Government an
idea that the Opposition will not always
take the budget as it is. You know
we always look forward to the budget
speech being presented to this House,
but perhaps in one or two years there
might not be a budget speech which is
really right and proper. This year
quote the President our estimate is over
two million eight hundred thousand
dollars; last year it was supposed to be
near $600,000. You know one word can
change the whole look of things and I
take note that that word was used for
a second time. "Over" $600,000. How-
ever it was two hundred thousand
grant-in-aid but there will not be any
serious change in the budgeting of the
estimate because most of it will be used
up in the normal increases, increments
etc. and so there is no need, so that we
have gained nothing this year over last
year and we need not feel that the


delegation that went to London had
made such a wonderful success. Of
course the Leader of the Opposition
went on this tour already and it is not
new to him. We were sent to London
to do a job and we did it; but of course
being more watched in the present
Government we did not boast ourselves
with the achievement that was made.
We went on our mission and did what
Swe can; but here they are in the new
Government boasting of what they have
achieved. I know my good friend in
the Government accused me of being
childish in my attitude today. I do not
want to go on and make flowery
speeches these days. Of course he is
a most brilliant man in his language,
and he is capable of doing so. Now the
President .drew our attention to the
fact and you would bear with me if I
have taken all that was said in the
speech, and I am going to deal with
one point he said. He thought that the
British Government very . in giving
their grant in aid-an increase at this
stage when they are having financial
difficulties in England. I am not saying
that this Government is not happy in
receiving what they got. But here it
is, although the British Government
have financial difficulties, they have
seen the way to give us an increase in
grant-in-aid; yet I have seen in the
estimates that you have bluntly refused
to increase the grant for Bequia Dis-
trict Council. Had the British Govern-
ment dealt with you the way that you
deal with Bequia what would have be-
come of us. I just told you what we
have we spend. What we have we
spend on our work. Just now the Brit-
ish Government will give us no more
grant-in-aid and we will have to go to
our own West Indian to ask for grant-
in-aid. That is why this Government
has to work even harder than the last
time in order to build up our economy,
or else we would be faced with the same
fate as Bequia District Council.
Next point: Mr. President, three
quarters of this address was taken up








to tell this House of the achievements
of the former Government. Three
quarters of the address, Mr. President.
He talks of the various schemes-Feeder
Roads, driving through Mesopotamia,
driving to the Cumberland Valley.
These were all planned years ahead.
The Airport: Do you know that the
airport was being talked about for years.
Before there was a Ministerial Govern-
ment the electorate was not responsi-
ble for development or for engineering
the schemes, they were left in the
hands of the Heads ofw Departments.
But the Electorate was responsible to
the people and the more the people the
more they are responsible for implement
the schemes for development of the
country. So again when the Minis-
terial system was introduced, -the air-
port became one of my pets, and I will
say before the last Government went
out of power we got the funds for the
building of the airport. It is the duty-
of this Government now to put the
wheels into operation, and have the
airport an accomplished fact. Central
Housing and Planning is another scheme
before us in this House-another scheme
again that was approved in the last
Government. And because the money
for that scheme has been approved in
the last Government of course by now
the present Government have started
so that they might get things going on
that scheme.
The School Building Programme: I
notice with great delight that they are
going to open four new schools, so I
must congratulate the Government for
the able way in which they have put
forward to us this morning to bring to
light all these schemes:. Feeder Roads,
the water scheme-these are schemes
which the old Government has put into
motion, that is why my friend on my
left in the Opposition asked the Gov-
ernment what plans, they are going to
put forward for the future for the eco-
nomic development of the people. By
each scheme that is being put into


motion you are able to jack the rev-
enue up because with this money in
circulation people are able to spend
more, therefore the imports become
greater, so we don't beat around the
bush since your present Government
has just come into office, you are sup-
posed to carry on, and I know these
development money must get into the
hands of the people-the carpenters,
labourers, roadworkers and other work-
men. I notice there is talk about the
development team. Of course I have
very little to speak of the development
team report accepted by this House of
the way it was conducted; but with an
able Government here today I believe
that they will be able to find money to
implement the report submitted by the
team. But I doubt this will be in the
next 10 to 15 years to come. By that
time I will be gone.
As to fisheries, 1 do not like to com-
ment. They can have all the Fish ex-
perts here if they have no market for
fish the whole thing will be -a joke.
There is no organized local market and
there has been a hold up on Govern-
ment funds. The Member of the Opposi-
tion mentioned the price of fish and
though I do not agree with him on the
subject, the situation is one ilat needs
certain amount of investigation. Quite
a lot of fish has been coming to this
port and of course the people of Kings-
town use a lot of it. Fish must be
bought but the fault lies here right in
the Kingstown market. They charge
more fees here in the local market than
they charge in Grenada, St. Lucia or
any other place. It is of course not the
fault of the fisherman. For the benefit
of the people here I am glad for the
opportunity because the fishermen have
no engines and they must return tV their
homeland in their fishing boats to buy
fish from the fishermen at the cheap-
est possible price and then go and sell
them at the dearest possible price. Fish
some time ago before the present rise
in price, was sold here for 14 cents per
lb. for red fish and the fishermen from









the Grenadines had refused to take
that when 67 men from the market in
Grenada bought the fish and sold it at
14 cents and made a general profit of 40
per cent. You can get all the fish you
want but the situation lies in the or-
ganisation of the local market coupled
with the fees which the local vendor
demands of the fisherman. We appreci-
ate the fact that you have made avail-
able some amount of money in the esti-
mates. That is we had in the former
budget a certain amount of money
which was to be spent on fishery loans,
but we did not get it on account of the
fact that there was development funds
which should have been used as loans to
fishermen. There was a certain amount
of difficulty in the presentation of the
scheme and so the Agricultural Depart-
ment dicd not quite see what to set for-
ward in completing the scheme, but
whatever is the case for that depart-
ment, so it was ended. You know the
fishery report has not yet reached here
because of the fact of that existing de-
partment, so they need not sit in their
office and direct the affairs of divided
territories, hopeless.
The Cane Farmers Association-a
most necessary thing I know; it should
be the pet subject of the new Govern-
ment and no less a person than the
Member for North Windward. It is one
of his baby and he will have to nurse it.
Well of course, as the President rightly
puts it perhaps the Opposition would
like to 'walk stick' on his address. We
don't walk any sticks at all in the Oppo-
siticn. This is an oil game at which
great is the value and work of the per-
former. I note perhaps in passing it
might not have been said.
Now I turn to the speech of the Fi-
nancial Secretary: Before I begin to
comment on the Financial Secretary's
speech I must say that I had the plea-
sure of going to London with the Finan-
cial Secretary in 1957 and I must join
the President to say that the Financial
Secretary put his heart and hand into


his work in every respect. It is only a
year ago we went to London for the
estimates and we got on very well to-
gether and we made the 1957 budget
which passed the House on record with-
out debate. The attributed sum of Re-
venue Estimate passed for the Govern-
ment Revenue Department well this
Government increase had this oppor-
unity to add more to the revenue-a
more real estimate of revenue; but again
the chief officer thought and put into
motion what was left by the last Gov-
ernment. Of course you cannot beat
facts and I do not intend to waste any
time on this subject in discussing these
facts but I will mention when the
Financial Secretary said "How much
longer we can go on without increasing
other taxes and charges I do not know,
but some increases must inevitably be
faced sometime if the various public
and social services continue to expand
as they have done in recent years.'y
Mr. President, I must say that it is the
duty of this Government with a full-
fledged party in power and we must not
disregard the fact that another mem-
ber of the Opposition is now on the
Government side-my able friend on the
immediate right is a member of the
party Government, so I think it is time
the Government get down and really
plan ways and means of meeting the
increased costs that go with the in-
creased population and the increased
demands of the people of this country.
I must tell you be not too long in getting
the plans started less five years will
pass and you will not do anything in
meeting these expenses that are neces-
sary for the standard of living of the
people.
I listened again to the Financial Sec-
retary and of course I do not quite
agree with the bold statement here
when he said "but one may well ask
whether the substantial overall im-
provement in the salaries of about 500
other teachers has not been lost sight
of in these discussions." The Opposi-
tion have no intention to disrupt the








organisation in the Education Depart-
ment but the Opposition must I repeat
must bring to the notice of this Govern-
ment facts that are too glaring. We
have nothing against the direct trans-
fer of teachers. Transfers have to be
made; even the Minister for Education
and Social Services knows that the
action taken was not intended to cause
or any whether or not-I know that if
he was at all impartial he would in-
vestigate such irregularities and any
Government would especially when the
loyal Opposition had brought it to their
notice. So I am aware that the Fin-
ancial Secretary who said that the
critics were on this side of the House
is good for the Government and for all
concerned.
Of course we hee increase of the
Medical votes. That is necessary as we
see the extension of the hospital but
in the overall picture I must draw the
attention of the Minister that not only
the Central Hospital must be watched
carefully, but there are six Casualty
Hospitals and it is your duty to see that
these Casualty Hospitals-if you will go
and see them, see what the people of
the Colony have to use-do not allow
me to repeat. Of course I was in the
former Government and I so not allow
myself to go and bathe in the past, but
Instead of increases in Medical and
Hospital would not have these Casual-
ty Hospitals be put in shape for the
use of the people in the districts? There
is rio shortage of doctors again so they
cannot blindfold our eyes to the fact
that there are no medical officers in
charge at the Bequia Casualty Hospital.
There is now in each district its medi-
cal officer and there is now even an
application from one of the boys-our
local boys-which had to be turned
down because we cannot find any
vacancy right now. I would like to see
money put into these casualty hospitals,
I want to see them completely fur-
nished. I went to Georgetown on sev-
eral occasions with both ministers and
the Minister seems to blame the last


Government for not paying attention
to the building utilised as the hospital.
Of course on the whole the development
cost was steep, there were plans for
building a new Casualty Hospital at
Georgetown, but rise in cost of labour
has caused the new hospital to be put
off from the C.D. & W. allocations given
to us. Not only was the Casualty Hos-
pital cut off, but the extension to the
nurses hostel was deferred until a later
season. It is the duty of this new Gov-
ernment now to find funds either from
C.D. & W. funds, loans or grants for
building, repairing or renovating the
Casualty Hospital. I am helping the
member to find funds and that the
hospital must be given priority in the
scheme of things. So when he made
his remarks just now-the Leader of the
Government-branding the last Gov-
ernment for paying total disregard to
his constituency, I must say that it is
not right; if you have that, erase it
from your mind, you need not be re-
vengeful. I hope you will find it possi-
ble to have the additional things done,
first things must be first.
I am glad to see that something is
done for the Police Constables; that
would not have passed this House un-
less meeting with our approval.
Another one is the nurses business.
The nurses business is not an overnight
business with the Minister-the pres-
ent minister of Social Services. It
happened that in London the matter
gained great fame and it was given
consideration in the Colonial Office.
I also must agree with the Financial
Secretary who said that the problem of
the Government is now a ticklish one,
and I am glad to see that the Leader
.of the present Government was the
former Leader of the Opposition, now
showing the facts of the bringing back
of this country back its finance. He
was forced to present here that he
wasn't able to achieve any new aid but
increase the grant-in-aid. Therefore he
has fallen in the same old line. In that
I see that it will take the next ten or








fifteen years to get St. Vincent back in
its financial position, and that is by
another Government-not this one;
with this Government it will take an-
other twenty-five years.
I now turn to the debate of the Hon-
ourable Minister for Communications
and Works. I have no intention to
prolong the debate on this head be-
cause I was formerly Minister for Com-
munications and Works and I do not
want to "walk any stick"; but there is
one point'that is not quite clear when
the Minister spoke about lands in future
-when he said about lands and surveys.
This Lands and Survey had been great-
ly corrupted-a complicated issue. It
was started when there was not a min-
isterial government, when the govern-
ment. in power had been the leader of
warfare, the present government then
the member not of the Government,
had since started an appeal that if the
money should be utilised in training
surveyors in Trinidad and those survey-
ors return while two surveyors were
included in the estimates-one surveyor
-or who was supposed to be the Crown
Surveyor and the other surveyor was
supposed to be in charge of development
programme which included the cadas-
tral survey; well, unfinished work was
left over the past year when there was
only one surveyor in charge of lands;
but while there was work to be caught
up with, one post of surveyor became
vacant and had not been filled. Well
all those were not interested and I be-
lieve that is why the Opposition was well
to recommend the present Wason to re-
main in the post. It was not necessary
until the present month to complete any
Cadastral Survey in this country unless
a substantial increase was made on the
development plan for the survey depart-
ment, and I believe that is why the
Minister told you this morning that he
believes that the money would be better
spent on something else. It is not only
the view of the Minister but I brought
this department under proper control


because I felt that in making a proper
survey limit the funds at your disposal
and I believe we can get funds to prop-
erly survey the lands around St. Vin-
cent. Well that is a matter for the
Minister; he is more equipped, I must
say, he was in the Survey Department
and that is his baby. And now I heard
he has turned over the Survey Depart-
ment to the Minister for Trade and
Production. I think .t takes very long
for him to see first and get acquainted
with the survey department.
Now another point: A few years ago
each department was responsible for
its own lighting; that was when the
Government operated the old power
station here. When the C.D.C. took
over, it was thought fit by the then
Financial Secretary as head of the de-
partment to see how it is. When one
Financial Secretary went the old sys-
tem was changed. Now the Govern-
ment lay down the policy and the heads
of Department are supposed to carry
out the policy so that is how the Gov-
ernment controls. Formerly the Fin-
ancial Secretary and the heads of de-
partments prepared the estimate; not it
is the three ministers and the Minister
of Finance they set a fixed policy. So
it is not the fault of any minister or
leader of the Government concerned
why this is pooled together. It was
that the heads of departments did not
take the proper measures to change
it around to the departments. They
ignored the fixed estimate and what
it will cost to light a government build-
ing; so it remained pooled together.
The estimate presented in the 1956 bud-
get the Financial Secretary did not quite
agree with it, and it was not given its
proper working and that is why you
find departments more or less becom-
ing slack and lighting facilities became
overwhelming and they had to supple-
ment the votes. Now that you have a
basis for lighting estimate the Minister
for Communications should know what
is to be done and I agree with him to








16e each department shoulder Its own
responsibility and take control of its
lighting.
The Member for South Leeward at-
tacked the leader of the Government,
the Chief Minister said that it was
necessary to carry the mails in a more
dignified manner. I agree with the
Minister that mails of the Government
should be carried in a more dignified
manner, but the Minister will see an..:
prove to us that it was not going to
cost him the same to run a mail in the
Windward as it costs to run on the Lee-
ward coast. In other words the same
position in the former Government that
to run the mail in one side of the island
is not always the same as the other
side. The Minister will find it neces-
sary to give us transport to run mails
from St. Vincent to the Grenadines
which is the service of the people. Now
you have the Grenadines mail service
which for years is still run in thl sirte
manner. Things that happened 25
years ago are still happening now.
When will you take care of your depen-
dencies? The pilot of the plane I do
not know if it is true or what it is, but
he had found it difficult to land in
Bequia, so the-tourist cannot get over,
You will have to get another tourist
development scheme. I am warning
this Government, that they are not tak-
ing care, they must make available
within the next month a launch or a
motor boat to run the mail from here
to Bequia. That boat can carry not
only mails but passengers as well. The
mail boat can also serve several pur-
poses in emergency instead of some
boat that has to be chartered either at
the Government's expense or some poor
unfortunate person who can ill afford
to pay. It is not always nice when you
have to sail those seas or leave your
home to come to the mainland, when
you get outside in the gust df wind and
the roaring seas it is not so comfort-
able to leave Bequia seven the morn-
ing and get here at around twelve and
to leave at sundown. I would like cer-


tain members of the Government to go
on one of these boats one of these days.
The. leader of the Government had a
good taste when nearly lost his life
during the election campaign. He had
a terrible time coming over front Bequla.
The daily paid workers: nae Min-
ister of course did not put it into very
language. He meant well of course, he
intended to give some praise to his
Government but what he did-I saw
before me a special warrant some days
ago to meet the cost of daily rates for
daily paid workers. He did not submit
the true and right things fjr these
people for whom the dally rates were
not good enough; and when it came to
insert the proper thing into Ihe esti-
mate-and if I have been incorrect the
Minister of Finance can bear out or a
member of Government. I stated in
this House that I couldn't get an in-
crease in pay but it was agreed upon
that I maintain a link between a major
scheme when necessary and I saw a
Special Warrant passed by Finance
Committee to meet the amount to pay
the increase, so when the Minister came
here this morning and said that the
caily paid workers were denied the
privilege of increase wages you are mis-
guided along those lines. The Minister
A-id not mention the extension of the
existing wharves service. We not only
have a wharf ,scheme, a wharf move-
ment, last year there was voted the sum
of some five thousand dollars ?or extend-
ing the present wharf sa thit you A.:ight
get a little deeper hartl-iu- .o that large
boats may be able to come along and
deposit their passengers etc. We know
of the deep water scheme, but Dtht coes
not prevent this Governmen from mak-
ing some tentative arrangement so that
at least the small crafts can come
alongside and put their passengers
ashore along the quay. That of course
was another of my pet subjects and I am
sorry it has not been included in the
estimates. I see that the Minister for
Education and Social Services did not of
course want to burden our patience too.








long when he is making his speech, but
of course even those departments that
mean very much to the Minister for
Education I am glad that he has men-
tioned the fact that he is getting along
wift tlh Science Laboratory for the
Grammar School. I hope he will speed
up work and get on with the Education
so that we can get more convenience
for our boys and girls.
The Minister for Trade and Produc-
tion mentioned "self contained" in his
speech by some former minister I do
not think he is quite right to such a
comment made in this House. I Lo not
believe any of us has any diploma in
economics but what I would have
thought the Minister for Trade an:. Pro-
ducticn having heard the Member for
South Leeward speaking would of course
try to outline some plan not only what
he had included in the budget but what
he hopes to get up for the development
and improvement of the economy of this
island. It is all well and good that we
sit here and bling a budget to this House
and pass it every year, but the time is
ripe and even far gone when we should
think of son.ething to assist in the
banana, the arrowroot and cotton; we
should at least be able to hold our own
in the Federation of the West Indies. It
is net always good to go abroad and
make boastful and big political speeches
being: big boys of the west Indian Is-
lands can boast. As the Minister of this
country we are on dole making noise on
the cne hand about political and consti-
tutional rights and on the other hand
our resources and economy are left to
go to pieces.
Before I close I had no intention of
mentioningg, but the Leader of the Gov-
ernment saw it fit to put the blame on
the last Government. Any Minister or
any Member of the Government during
his time of office can fix for himself any
salaries or anything to suit -his purpose
or the purpose cf the people. I will
have no objection whatever if the mem-
bers of. the Government increase the


salaries of the officers with low salaries,
by all means increase them. But it
is unfair to say that the last Govern-
ment engineered the 20% increase of
salary which they got. We go on a
Windward Islands basis. Grenada who
could balance their budget at the time
threw out the 20% increase which we
got. After Grenada got the 20% in-
crease, of salary a despatch was sent
down that we too can get the 20%
increase, but of course at the time they
could not take the decision in that. the
Government was in its last stage and a
motion for 20% increase was brought
before this House for the daily paid
workers, and what else could Govern-
ment do because we thought it was not
fair to accept 20% increase for ourselves
and not get a similar treatment for the
daily paid workers, and on that basis we
could not accept 20% increase on the
salaries of 'ministers; so when the
Leader of the Government said that we
are the ones who-we made no noise
about 20% increase, it was settled and
that was that. I am sorry that the
member here gave cause to arouse the
leader of Government to make such an
unfair statement. In all good graces
although the last Government was not
a full fledged party Government they
have set a leading example not only to
party Government but to other proceed-
ings, and although a full fledged party
government is in power with a new con-
stitution-Ministerial system better than
the past, we have laid the foundation in
the past for a good ministerial Govern-
ment, and for that this Government in
its time has brought to this House for
debate the 1958 budget, has debated a
whole day on the same form as the last
Government. We here are not working
in the good interest of the people. I
remember in the last Government the
Ministerial system-I will not say the
Ministerial system that had operated in
St. Vincent had no shortcomings there
were lots of shortcomings, but it is for
this present Government to get down to
business to remedy them and get on with







the work. Set political differences aside
Sand study the development of the people
and last but not least to pull their
weight in the new Federation. I thank
you.

HoN. S. E. SLATER: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I believe that I
also must add my quota. After sitting
here and listening to two political pre-
liminary speeches-this is to say speech-
es before the Federal campaign. I do
appreciate it and I think it is worth the
while, but I don't believe that all that
was said was really meant. I have
heard the Member for the Grenadines
accusing the present Government for
continuing what was handed down to
them. As a matter of fact, I intend to
praise the new Government, because
they are all more or less new to what
is going on inside here. It is only one
member of this council who has re-
turned. As you see what we have done
was what was laid down by the old
Government. I am saying this, that
the 10-year plan was laid down before
any Minister was here in this House.
Road, Water and everything else were.
schemes to be followed on year after
year. Well, this island is purely agri-
cultural. Those are necessary schemes
you couldn't stop them whether you
thought this is my Government, or have
changed because it is not my concern
today, I am not going to follow where
the other Government left off; but they
must go on because it is agriculture,
water and other things are necessary
if the lives are to be kept going. For
that reason I have a right to support
the Government today. I am one who
is not prepared to pull any punches, if
anything goes wrong, I will come out
and say so; for that reason I am sup-
porting them. You talked about dis-
crimination in the school for the Gren-
adines, I don't think that is a true
speech at all, because in your day you
should have done more or less all that
is necessary for the Grenadines. Mr.
President, I don't believe that the op-


position stated here on both sides of
the House were necessary. I believe
the Member for the Grenadines should
have fought for his territory during
his term of office. I may speak, and
if I am wrong I believe he has done
favourably well for the Grenadines. As
a Member of Council I had to accept
what was given me for my constituency.
If I am wrong, others are there to guide
me. I am not merely here to accuse
anybody; but all I am saying is I would
like this Government to get together
and plan, not only-every office but the
Ministers concerned should get together
and plan what is best to be done for
this island. In doing that I believe
that they cannot be far wrong. It is
the only way you can get anything good,
so that I am going to make my bid. I
do hope that whatever you have in your
books there will be a little left to help
me in North Leeward. I am asking the
Minister concerned to assist me with a
school for Rose Hall. I heard education
so forcefully put up here this morning,
and I believe education is not only
necessary for .Kingstown but more
necessary for the interior districts, be-
cause I can assure you, men from those
parts very often come into the town
and become very prominent, you can-
not doubt that. Rose Hall I believe
should be taken of, not only a school
but I am also asking that if any money
is left from the budget to assist me with
a clinic for Rose Hall. Instead of argu-
ing I am only putting that forward.
Talking about education, I believe that
we could use the Agricultural Depart-
ment in Kingstown as an annex for the
High School or the Grammar School.
Practically speaking the office of the/
Agricultural Department should be down
at Camden Park. And you have the
space there now, instead of trying to
battle that way you can make a shed
just over the whole yard along the main
building and bring down your form I
and II boys there. In that way you may
be able to help those people who are
getting ambitious today in all the








parishes of this island and the children
would be getting more education. Time
will tell for itself after you have made
a stand, and I believe you will accom-
plish completing a school building for
the children. So, Gentlemen, all this
unnecessary idleness it is useless kick-
ing against the pricks since I cannot
change the estimate, I think I can add
a little more to it to get more benefit
for all concern. I am not prepared to
carry out any elaborate scheme, but I
will still make a try. The Ex-Minister
must try to live in better harmony and
he must realise that no one man is
wholly and solely responsible for what
is done. It takes all of us to play his
part to make this St. Vincent a better
island. Well I hope that all of us is
going to play his part. I thank you.

HON. A. C. CYRUS: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I have three small
points in the budget session that I will
like to speak on, and I could not be on
good terms with my conscience if I
didn't discuss them here this evening.
Before discussing them, I must say that
I sat here this evening and enjoyed a
real good treat in the addresses deliver-
ed by the President of the House and
the Financial Secretary. They have
given us a retrospective view which a
lot of us have forgotten what took place
last year and the year before, and they
have given us a peep into what is to
come for the current year. It was both
pleasant and interesting too to hear the
Minister for Communications and Works
explaining certain intricacies into the
estimate of which we know nothing or
even though it might have been chal-
lenged. It gave me the impression that
he has knowledge a working knowledge
of the departments, and I think he too.
ought to be commended for getting
through at such a short time with the
subject in hand. The Minister for
Social Services, he in like manner did
a good job. Well I must say that I was
a bit disappointed in the Chief Minister
'because while I was listening for him to


do likewise he bothered so much with
the Opposition trying to explain some
of the attacks made upon him that he
didn't confine himself to the budget
and explained those things that he
ought to explain. However I am still
satisfied that everything went well.
But to get to those points that bear
greatly with me, Mr. President: One
is the Central Housing and Planning
Authority. From time immemorial this
Government has been giving the Cen-
tral Housing and Planning Authority
six meagre thousand dollars with which
to function for a whole year, and every-
body knows of the dilapidated condi-
tion in which some people are living.
Everybody knows that a good many
people are living in dirt and squalor
and because of that they keep flocking
to the Central Housing and Planning
Authority for assistance. Then every
now and again something may develop
so that we have to alter drains and
such things. Yet when we ask for in-
crease on the six thousand dollars we
are told 'No'. Apparently, Mr. Presi-
dent it is forgotten that the population
is growing and from 1946 we have been
getting six thousand dollars. In 1958
to give the same six thousand dollars
you could see that is a joke quite natu-
rally to cope with the demands with
which the department has to encounter.
Nevertheless, now somebody-I think
was the Minister for Trade and Produc-
tion made mention of lumber cutting.
This year we asked for $2,400 more with
a view to carry out our lumber cutting,
and as those people who are not in an
organised scheme come to us, we can'
say 'well we will help you with an
amount of up to $80-not in cash, but
we give lumber'. In this book of words
and figures we are going to be faced
with the same old problem: Year after
year we are going through the same
trouble with those people, and it is in-
creasing because the population is grow-
ing. That is a matter that needs look-
ing into and I am making this point
now so that the relevant minister will








be awakened to a clearer conception
of the state of affairs as far as housing
goes, and that the next time you are
preparing the estimate you will no
longer brush aside the demands which
the Central Housing and Planning
Authority have been making for quite
a number of years.
I come now, Mr. President, to the
Mental Hospital: I wish to sing of the
praise of the Medical Department for
the work they have been doing. I can
remember not so long ago when a per-
son too sick with T.B. they went to a
special place at the hospital until they
die. Today it is a question of going
for a few days to a particular place
and come out and take one's place in
the community. In the circumstances
I have no right to question the increase
that the Medical Department has been
spending, or that the demand was made
for 1958; but I noticed a total absence
of the Ministers and everybody in com-
menting about the estimate on hospitals
nobody mentioned the Mental Hospital.
Again the Committee of the Mental
Hospital has been rapping with bruised
knuckles at the doors of government
asking that private wards be put down,
because every now and again you have
a lot of people who get mentally sick
and instead of going to Barbados you
can well put them here. But those
people who are however forced to go to
Barbados because you haven't got any
suitable place here for them. This
state of affair is quite unfair in that
we have $4,000 put to major repairs.
What major repairs can $4,000 do. You
want somewhere to carry out the medi-
cal treatment. You want beds or cots
on which the people can go and sleep
because they cannot be discharged im-
mediately after they are treated. We
have not got that yet, and there are
quite a lot of other amenities. The
Authorities on the subject tell you that
all those cell doors should be removed
because they are psychologically bad.
We haven't got down to that yet and
Dr. Lloyd-Still who was in charge of


the Barbados Mental Hospital tells you
that the treatment here is the same as
you would get in Barbados. As a matter
of fact the instrument we are using
here is more modern, because it was
bought later. A man was sent up there
for training and he is doing a very
good job. There are quite a lot of
things still to be done. I am not say-
ing, Mr. President, that nothing has
been done. There are some slight im-
provements that have been made; as
for instance you have an airing court,
and if you went to the hospital on a
day like this, you would not meet the
inmates in the immediate compound,
they will be in the airing court. There
are quite a lot of other things need to
be done. If this Government will con-
template the effort along those lines it
will be found that a mental patient will
be treated like any other patient in the
Government Hospiital who is undergo-
ing physical treatment. The element
of stigma will be removed so that when
a person comes from the mental Hos-
pital he will not be pointed at with
stigmatic finger but he will come out
like a normal person going to the Colo-
nial Hospital.. But we are centering
out attention on all other things and
the mental hospital is left to take care
of itself. Well I am saying this Mr.
President for what it is worth-I am
hoping that in the 1959 estimates some
consideration would be given and that
is to put down private wards and other
major improvements-not just calling it
major improvement when you just have
$4,000 to be spent on major improve-
ment on a place like that.
I must now turn Sir, to the question
of tourism. You have Mr. Financial
Secretary, Subvention here $4,000-
Tourism. Last year I sat here about
this same time and I heard the Finari-
cial Secretary in very eloquent language
tell us of tourism, how much money
was subvented for tourism and that it
needed a high calibre person to be the
head of that department. It is one
year and that department has not been'


I 1. *t








established. It is because that high
calibre person has not been found? Or
what? Those of us who listened a few
nights ago would have heard that Gren-
ada could not have a holiday when the
Governor-General of the West Indies
was there because a tourist ship was
calling there, and instead of taking a
holiday the stores were required to re-
main open overtime and the people of
Grenada were asked to supply ninety
cars to accommodate the tourists. What
has become of St. Vincent? Dominica
is the same. We are expecting a big
tourist trade and I think last year was
the first time for Dominica. Everybody
is boasting of what tourist business we
are going to get. We all are envisaging
a lot of money from tourism; but poor
St..Vincent cannot get any. The truth
is that sometimes .we haven't got trans-
portation here. I can see that part and
other excuses-we haven't got hotel
accommodation. But if you create the
demand you will see hotel go up here
fast enough. There are a lot of people
here in this place who have money for
investment if only a demand is created.
It is true we haven't got means by which
people can come in and go out frequent-
ly, but we can at least hope to get a
boat passing every now and again the
same' as how Dominica is working on
what they are expecting. As for Anti-
gua and those places I do not want to
mention them, but I will confine my
argument to the Windward Islands.
Why can't we hope to get some tourist
here? Who is to be blamed? In 1955
I passed at Grenada and at that time
there was a conference in the Dutch
West Indies Surinam. We were repre-
sented at that conference so was Gren-
ada and all the other territories. When
I got to Grenada every other person I
met was talking of tourism. How many
tourist they are expecting for the year
and how much money they intend to
make. When I came home to St. Vin-
cent-although St. Vincent was repre-
sented at the same conference yet I
came home and met everybody as if


they were sleeping-not a word on
tourism. I tried to stir up an argument
here and there but nobody seems in-
terested. That is why we have to face
the fact that Grenada Is going ahead.
The other night I heard reference was
made to Grenada as the Capital of the
Windward Islands. It has to be termed
the capital of the Windward Islands
because there is money and the people
are up and doing; they are pushed to
the front light. This is absolutely true.
What are we doing? Mr. President, I
am going to finish now but this is a
matter that bears greatly with me, and
you can expect Sir, to hear me rapping
at the doors and on these tables with
bruised knuckles until something very
tangible is done.

Mr. PRESIDENT: If no other Honour-
able Member wishes to speak on this
debate I will ask the Honourable Fin-
ancial Secretary to avail himself his
right to reply.

HON. B. R. THOMAS: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, in rising to reply
to the debate on the 1958 Budget, I
should first like to thank you for the
very nice things that have been said
by the Ministers on my right and Hon-
ourable Members opposite. It is a very
typical of the kind reception I received
in St. Vincent. Secondly I should like
to compliment the Honourable Minister
for Trade and Production for the very
able way in which he has defended the
many criticisms levelled against the
budget. I am most grateful because he
has saved me with a heavy task-in fact
he left me very little to do. There are
one or two points which I should like
to clarify. First of all the Honourable
Member for South Leeward referred to
Bananas and I think it gave me the
impression that Government didn't
have much to compliment itself over
that it happened anyway, and there is
nothing that we should be proud of.
I don't believe he quite meant that;
but that is how I understand it. Well








I should like to remind the House that
in the previous Government thirty thou-
sand pounds loan was made available
to Government to plant bananas-it
couldn't have started without that.
Next thing he referred to was the main-
tenance of buildings. Now it does seem
a lot of money, I agree, but we have
more buildings to maintain so therefore
you have to get the money to do it. And
of course materials and wages cost more.
But you are planning to correct what
was done before-that is neglect them.
What would happen then? That ugly
monster 'Deferred Maintenance will
raise its head again; so I do beg the
House again never to develop that kind
of finance again. I am sure it is a case
of penny wise and pound foolish.
Now the question raised why we
haven't got another secondary school
in the budget. Of course if the Honour-
able Member raised the issue he knows
perfectly well that we cannot put new
school in the ordinary budget, they
must come out of the development pro-
gramme and development programme
was drawn up by the previous Govern-
ment of which he was a member, and
it has passed through the Committee
so there is nothing more we can do
about that.
Next point is Roads: It has been
said that not enough was done to get
bananas. Well in the past year Gov-
ernment has taken over i0 miles from
the Central Housing and Planning and
also 17 miles of former estate roads,
and it has oiled 8 miles, and that is as
far as they have got for the first time.
And it also has on its programme the
oiling of a large section of the Leeward
Highway from development programme.
So I don't think as he claimed that
nothing is being done for the banana
industry.
Now another reference was being made
to Camden Park. I think it is hardly
fair to compare it to an estate (a private
estate) which makes money. It might
probably make money but of course its


function is not to make money, but to
carry out and disperse investigation for
the benefit of the whole island and it is
true at the moment that a large increase
to this Government's contribution is to
this. Well again I will point out that
this is an old scheme which was ap-
proved by the previous Government with
the condition that it was provided for
first year by C.D. & W. which pay for
the whole. The Second year this Gov-
,ernment contributes 25% and the third
year this Government contributes 50%.
So including this large increase in the
budget for 1958 the present Govern-
ment is only carrying on a plan ap-
proved by a previous Government.
Now again Economic Development:
We have been accused of neglecting this
side of the budget. I don't think that
is fair either. You have Camden Park
which is essentially an economic de-
velopment research. We have timber.
There was a new appointment last year,
and now we bought a new land rover.
Loans to Fishermen a Marketing Board
and of course research on arrowroot.
Now those are essentially development
work.
Next thing was Income Tax: Now
there seems to be some resentment that
the Banana growers should pay income
tax, and I will ask 'Why not? It has
been suggested that it is entirely be-
cause of his effort we are having these
bananas grown in profusion. But what
is the good of debating the future of
bananas if we cannot get a market, and
as I said last year that this year we have
got something like four times as much
money on road maintenance to get those
bananas into Kingstown, and everyone
knows it is a universal benefit in the
island, and the banana growers are the
people who benefited most. And I think
they should pay their share of increase
in the road maintenance money. ,
Now another criticism levelled at Gov-
ernment is a departmental one that it
was left to the heads of departments.
Now I really think that is a bit unfair.








I remember quite distinctly going to His
IRonour the Administrator last Septem-
ber and suggested to him 'well look here
things will be very difficult for us in this
Government, we would not have enough
time, we will have to go to London
again, can t I produce a skeleton budget
before the new Government comes in?
He said 'No', the whole thing must start
from the bottom with the new Govern-
ment and that is exactly what he did.
There was not one figure on paper
before they came in, and it is therefore
essentially a budget made by the five
Ministers themselves; and that evidence
of that has been given today with a
most intimate knowledge of the esti-
mates presented by the supporters to the
budget. They could never have at-
tained that knowledge unless they have
taken a very keen interest in com-
pleting it, and had to give some service;
I wish you could have seen the enor-
mous batch of proposals they had to go
through from the various heads of de-
partments. I doubt if 20% of them were
put through. It meant a great deal of
shifting, and I would like to add my
quota of gratitude to them for the great
amount of time they sat in Executive
Council and doing a great deal of shift-
ing themselves before a doctor.
Now-I remember reference was made
to a landrover. Well now, last year the
Government placed a new post of For-
estry Officer. This Government thought
it a very good idea and they supported
it entirely. We should go a step fur-
ther-giving the tools to do the job.
It is no good sitting in an office. So
that is all you have done-you have
provided a man appointed for the first
time last year, by the previous Gov-
ernment, with a means of getting about
the island.
I will just conclude with reference to
what was said by the Honourable Mem-
ber for- the Grenadines. It has not
been easy to deal with these criticisms
because in tae first place the Honour-
able Member for South Leeward thought


there was nothing good about it, and
then the Honourable Member for the
Grenadines complimented and then try
to steal some of the credit by saying
that all you have done is to copy what
we have done last year; so I don't know
who to believe. I thank you.

HoN. B. R. THOMAS: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I move that the
Council resolve itself into Committee to
consider the bill clause by clause.

HoN. N. A. BERRIDGE: I second the
motion.

Mr. PRESIDENT: The question is put
to the House.
(All agreed.)
Council moved into Committee.
Council resumed.

Mr. PRESIDENT: Honourable Members,
I have the honour to report that a bill
for an Ordinance to provide for the
service of the Colony for the year ending
the thirty-first day of December, one
thousand nine hundred and fifty eight
has passed the Committee stage with-
out amendment.

HoN. B. R. THOMAS: I move that the
President's report be adopted.

HON. N. A. BERRIDdE: I second the
motion.
The question is put and agreed.

HON. B. R. THOMAS: I move that the
Bill be read a third time by title and
passed.

HON. N. A. BERRIDGE: I second the
motion.

Mr. PRESIDENT: Honourable Members
the question that a bill for an Ordinance
to provide for the service of the Colony
for the year ending the thirty-first day
of December one thousand nine hun-







54

dred and fifty-eight be read a third HoN. E. A. C. HUGHES: I beg to see-
time by title and passed is put to the ond that. ;
house. Mr. PRESIDENT: The question is put
All agreed. to the House?
All agreed.


HoN. N. A. BERRIDGE: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I have the honour
to move that this Council adjourn sine
die.


Mr. PRESIDENT: The House stands ad-
journed.
Adjourned 6.16 p.m.


* *. .4I 'Ir--.




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