Statutory Rules and Orders No....
 Supplement to Gazette: Minutes...

Title: Saint Vincent government gazette
Full Citation
Permanent Link: http://ufdc.ufl.edu/UF00077473/00371
 Material Information
Title: Saint Vincent government gazette
Alternate Title: Government gazette
St. Vincent government gazette
Physical Description: v. : ; 35 cm.
Language: English
Creator: Saint Vincent
Publisher: G.P.O.
Place of Publication: Kingstown, St. Vincent
Kingstown St. Vincent
Publication Date: April 8, 1958
Frequency: weekly
Subject: Gazettes -- Periodicals -- Saint Vincent   ( lcsh )
Genre: federal government publication   ( marcgt )
legislation   ( marcgt )
periodical   ( marcgt )
Spatial Coverage: Saint Vincent and the Grenadines -- Saint Vincent
Dates or Sequential Designation: v. 1, no. 1 (1868)-v. 112, no. 48 (Tues., 23 Oct. 1979)
General Note: Description based on: Vol. 111, no. 1 (Tues., 3 Jan. 1978); title from caption.
General Note: Supplements which accompany some numbers contain extraordinary issues, ordinances, statutory rules of order, etc.
 Record Information
Bibliographic ID: UF00077473
Volume ID: VID00371
Source Institution: University of Florida
Holding Location: University of Florida
Rights Management: All rights reserved by the source institution and holding location.
Resource Identifier: oclc - 19844741
lccn - sn 89018505
 Related Items
Succeeded by: Government gazette

Table of Contents
        Page 127
        Page 128
        Page 129
        Page 130
        Page 131
        Page 132
        Page 133
        Page 134
    Statutory Rules and Orders No. 15: The Motor Vehicles Road Traffic (Amendment) Regulations
        Page A-33
        Page A-34
    Supplement to Gazette: Minutes of the Meeting of the Legislative Council Held on the 6th March, 1958
        Page B-1
        Page B-2
        Page B-3
        Page B-4
        Page B-5
        Page B-6
        Page B-7
        Page B-8
        Page B-9
        Page B-10
        Page B-11
        Page B-12
        Page B-13
        Page B-14
        Page B-15
        Page B-16
        Page B-17
        Page B-18
        Page B-19
Full Text



PubliMied bh 6uthorilg.

VOL. 91.] SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 8 APRIL, 1958. [No. 20.


No. 181.
With reference to Government notice No. 162 of 1st April, 1958, His Honour
A. F. GILES, M.B.E., Administrator, St. Vincent, returned by air to-day at
1.30 p.m. and resumed the Administration of the Colony.
8th April, 1958.
(A. 49/1949.)

No. 182. Council Meeting in January, 1958. It
PRESS RELEASE. was then decided that the Federal Gov-
ernment, subject to agreement of Ja-
THE WEST INDIA REGIMENT. maica Government and Her Majesty's
Government, would assume responsi-
The question of The West India ability for Jamaica Regiment as from
Regiment has been under consideration 1958 in view of proposal already agreed
by West Indian Governments and Her to by Unit Governments that personnel
Majesty's Government for several years. of Jamaica Regiment would become in
Proposals for reformation of the Regi- effect the nucleus of the reformed West
ment presented to Unit Governments by India Regiment. Jamaica Government
the Secretary of State in 1954, and had worked out plans for improving
generally accepted by Governments, conditions of pay and service of Ja-
were that Jamaica Regiment would be maica Regiment, and was anxious to
disbanded and personnel willing to bring these improvements into effect as
serve and acceptable, would be absorbed early as possible. With the consent of
in the new regional Force. It was of the Advisory Council, improved pay
course not practicable to give effect to and terms of service were brought into
these proposals before the Federation of effect by Jamaica Government as from
The West Indies came into being. 1st January on understanding that the
2. Consultations, however, proceeded Federal Government accepted responsi-
during 1957 between Governments of ability for the Regiment of these im-
the Standing Federation Committee and proved rates of pay with effect from 1st
Her Majesty's Government, and the April, 1958. Funds were provided for
matter was further examined by the the purpose in the Federal estimates of
Governor-General and his Advisory expenditure for 1958. Detailed organi-

128 SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 8 APRIL, 1958.-(No. 20.)

station of The West India Regiment in-
cluding such matters as size and
method of development of Force, was
however left for consideration of Fed-
eral Government when fully constituted.
3. Decision of Advisory Council to
which Jamaica Government and Her
Majesty's Government have agreed
does not imply immediate change
in name and organisation of Ja-
maica Regiment on 1st April, 1958.
It will be for the Federal Ministers
to determine in consultation with
Her Majesty's Government and the
Government of Jamaica, settlement of
a number of technical and financial
details and precise dates when The West
India Regiment will be resuscitated for-
mally and Jamaica Regiment be dis-
banded. Another matter for agreement
will be the form of legislation required
to give effect to these changes.
4. It was however contemplated by
the Advisory Council that The West
India Regiment would be formally re-
constituted by 1st January, 1958, at the
latest, and it will be possible for this to
be done earlier if the Federal Govern-
ment so decides.
8th April, 1958.

No. 183.


has been appointed a Marriage Officer
of the Colony with effect from bth April,
8th April, 1958.
(J. 22/1951.)

No. 184.

has been appointed an Official Attestor
with effect from 8th April, 1958.
8th April, 1958.
(A. 5/1948.)

No. 185.

The undermentioned Bill is published
with this issue of the Gazette and may
be seen at the Government Office, King.,
town Library, District Post Offices.
Police Stations and at all Revenue
Bill for an Ordinance further to
amend the Registration of Docu-
ments Ordinance, 1937.
8th April, 1958.

No. 186.
The following Document is published
with this issue of the Gazette:-
S.R. & 0. No. 15.-The Motor Vehi-
cles and Road Traffic (Amendment)
8th April, 1958.

No. 187.

Copies of Minutes of the Meeting of
the Legislative Council held on the 6th
March, 1958, which may be seen at Gov-
ernment Office, the Kingstown Library
and at all Revenue Offices, are pub-
lished with this issue of the Gazette.
8th April, 1958.

No. 188.


Non pensionable post with salary
scale $624 x $72-$768 plus 20%. Apply
to Superintendent of Agriculture by
21st April stating educational and other
qualifications. Further particulars ob-
tainable from Office Superintendent,
Agricultural Department.
8th April, 1958.

No. 169.

Applications are invited for the post
of Marketing Officer, St. Vincent.
The salary of the post which is non-
pensionable i.- in the scale $4,080 x
$120-$4,800 per annum. The ap-
pointment will be on a contractual
basis for a period of two years in the
first instance.
The duties of the post are:
(i) to perform all duties in connec-
tion with the purchasing, grad-
ing, storage, packaging, ship-
ment and sale of a wide range
of agricultural commodities;
(ii) to supervise the accounting,
clerical and field staff which will
be employed in the Marketing
(iii) to carry out such other duties
which may be assigned to him
from time to time.


The applicant must have a good
general education and should possess
one or a combination of the following
(a) General business experience.
(b) Accounting experience.
(c) Experience or training in the
Marketing of Agricultural pro-
duce with particular emphasis
on ground provisions.
A good general knowledge of agri-
culture will be advantageous.
Further particulars regarding the
appointment may be obtained from the
Chief Secretary, Windward Islands,
Grenada, to whom applications should
be addressed to reach him not later than
the 15th April, 1958.
1st April, 1958.

No. 170.

Applications are invited for the post
of Agricultural Officer (Extension),
Department of Agriculture, St. Vincent.
The salary of the post, which is
pensionable, is in the scale $3,360 x
$120-$4,320, plus a pay addition of
20% of salary. The appointment will
be on a contractual basis or on
secondment, for a period of 2 years in
the first instance. The pension rights
of any pensionable seconded officer
will be preserved.
The duties of the officer will be
those assigned to him by the Superin-
tendent of Agriculture to whom he
will be directly responsible. Such
duties will include the direction of
Agricultural Extension and Soil Con-
servation programmes, as well as gen-
eral work of an administrative nature.
The minimum qualification re-
quired is the Diploma of the Imperial
College of Tropical Agriculture or an
equivalent degree, with experience in
Tropical Agriculture. General admin-
istrative experience and knowledge of
extension work would be advanta-
Further particulars regarding the ap-
pointmnent may be obtained from the
Chief Secretary, Windward Islands,
Grenada, to whom applications should
be addressed to reach him not later
than the 30th April, 1958.
1st April, 1958.

No. 171.


Applications are invited for appoint-
ment as Drawing Office Supervisor,
Geological Surveys Department, with
salary on the scale $3,696-$4,560 per
annum-non-pensionable; commencing
salary commensurate with qualifications
and/or experience; appointment on con-
tract for three years renewable by
mutual consent would be allowed on re-
quest. If appointment is on contract,
gratuity at the rate of 221/% of basic
salary will be paid in respect of each
completed period of three months' resi-
dent service.
2. Duties: To re-organise the draw-
ing office on modern lines, advise on new
equipment, instruct junior staff in the
compilation and laying out of topogra-
phic maps and the preparation of geo-
logical maps and drawings for publica-
tion, and prepare a physiographic map
of British Guiana; and to perform such
other duties as may be assigned by the
Ilead of the Department or other duly
authorised officer.
3. Qualifications: A good general
education, with either a School Certifi-
cate with four credits of which one must
be English Language, or the General
Certificate of Education with passes in
five subjects, including English Lan-
guage. Candidates should have consid-
erable experience preferably in a geolo-
gical drawing office, and should be
familiar with simple methods of prepar-
ing maps from aerial photographs.
4. Medical fitness: The successful
candidate, if not already holding a pen-
sionable post in the Public Service, will
be required to pass a medical examina-
tion for admission thereto.
5. Leave: General Orders and exist-
ing regulations on the subject provide
for five days' leave for each completed
month of resident service up to a maxi-
mum of six months. A minimum tour
of service is two years.
6. General Information: Appoint-
ment will be subject to Colonial Regu-
lations, General Orders, Stores Regula-
tions, Financial Regulations, and other
local regulations in force from time to
time in so far as they are applicable.
Passages to British Guiana for himself,
his wife and children (if any), not ex-
ceeding five persons in all, provided
they either accompany him to British
Guiana or join him there within twelve
months of his departure for the Colony:
(Children to be under 18 years of age,

130 SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 8 APRIL, 1958.-(No. 20.)

unmarried and dependent on the officer) ability is required. Academic qualifica-
would be provided on appointment and tions are desirable but not essential.
on the satisfactory completion of the 4. Applications stating name in full,
period of service if on contract. date and year of birth, qualifications
7. Applications stating name in full, and experience and accompanied by at
date and year of birth, educational least two recent testimonials should be
qualifications and experience, and ac-. addressed to the Chief Establishment
companies by at least two recent testi-! Officer, Public Buildings, Georgetown,
monials should be addressed to the for delivery not later than 22nd April,
Chief Establishment Officer, Public 1958. Candidates already in Public
Buildings, Georgetown, British Guiana, Service should submit their applications
to reach him not later than 14th April, through their Governments. Applica-
1958. Applications received after this tions received after this date will not be
date will not be considered. considered. Testimonials are not re-
1st April, 1958. quired for applicants already in Public
5. Further information obtainable
No. 172. on application to the Chief Establish-

Salary scale $624 x $36-$768 x $72-
$1,416 per annum plus 20% pensionable
pay addition. Travelling in accordance
with local regulations. Apply giving
full particulars, qualifications and expe-
rience, and attaching two testimonials,
not later than 30th April, 1958, to the
Assistant Administrator and Establish-
ment Officer, Government Office, from
whom further information concerning
duties etc., available on request.
1st April, 1958.
(C.L. 1/1948.)

No. 173.

Applications are invited for appoint-
ment as Permanent Secretary to the
Ministry of Trade and Industry, with
salary at $7,680 (B.W.I.) a year. The
post is pensionable, but appointment on
contract will be made in the case of a
candidate over the age of 40 years who
is not already in Public Service. If ap-
pointment is on contract, a gratuity at
the rate of 221/2% of basic salary for
each completed period of 3 months resi-
dent service will be paid.
2. The Ministry of Trade and Indus-
try deals with the subjects of Overseas
Agreements on Trade, the promotion of
Industry and Commerce, the Co-opera-
tive Movement, Industrial Investiga-
tions and Research and Trade Enquiries.
The Minister is responsible for the Gov-
ernment Departments of Supplies and
Prices, Import and Export Control and
Co-operative Development.
3. The Permanent Secretary is ad-
ministrative head of the Ministry and a
principal adviser to the Minister. A high
level of administrative and economic

ment Officer.
1st April, 1958.

By Command,

Acting Government Sccrciary.

8th April, 1958.




Grammar School: Grade of
Carl Raymond Neville
Alexander ...... 3
Roy Leslie Austin ...... 2
Berton Kenrick Bailey ...... 3
Junior Rudolph Onslow
Baynes ...... 2
Norton Ardon Bess ...... 2
Leroy Roland Bonadie ...... 3
Horace Darnley Noel
Cunningham ...... 2
Keith Arthur Smith
Cunningham ...... 2
Winston Erville Daisley ...... 3
Timothy Alban Daisy ...... 2
George Austin Davy ...... 3
Alfred Newlin Deare ...... 3
Harold Winston Dougan ...... 3
Raymond Dudley Gonsalves...... 2
Brian Michael Huggins ...... 2
Lennox Lancelot John ...... 2
Errol Gladstone King ...... 1
Noel Hughes Conway King ...... 1
Cyril Theodore Rudolph
Lewis ...... 2


Christian Ivor Martin
William Fitz-Patrick
Kerwyn Leslie Morris
Bruce Edgerton Mulraine ..
Harold Cornelius Patterson ......
Orloffe Edmund Paynter
Oswald Horace Vibert
Alfred Wesley Prescod
Harold Edward Providence ......
Fitz-Allen Everade Alastair
Winston Neville Anthony
Samuel Jason Rodney
Christian Aurelius Stephens
Leofric Leopold Forbes
Girls' High School:
Annabelle Victorine Alleyne
Cecily Bernica Anderson
Civilla Helena Antrobus
Patricia Alexandrina Tessel
Lorna Rose Marie Roxane
Delphine Angelia Daisy
Margot Diana DaSilva ......
Katherine Miriam Fraser ......
Jennie Maureen Anazelta
Marcia Charmain Payne
Peggy Anita Ince
Carlita Eleanor Lewis
Stephanie Theresa Lewis
Lorna Marcelle Melville
Gloria Sylvinia Pemberton
Lorna Valcina Pompey
Verbena Caroletha Richards
Monica Alison Sandy
Janet Valcina Williams

Grade of










Jennifer Ann Clarke ...... 3
Doris Alicene Frederick ...... 3
Rosamund Leo Freda Velma
Jackson ...... 3
Doreith Sylvenia John ...... 3
Annis Isola Millington ...... 3
Samuel Holista Ambrose ...... 3
Selywn Alfred Herbert ...... 3
Kenneth Oswald Jackson ...... 3
Cecil McLagan John ...... 3
Clement Jeremiah Noel ...... 3
Lincoln Horace O'Neal ...... 2
Clifford St.Clair Pitt ...... 2
Leroy Sylvester Raymond ...... 2
Stephen Onicimus Scrubb ...... 2
Ivan Bertram Stephens ...... 2
Bernard Macfadden Williams 3
Alfred Edward Dublin ...... 3

The following Teachers satisfied the
conditions For Part I of the Teachers'
Certificate Examination

Faustina Viola Harry
Pamelus Lewis Augustus
Randolph Alexis Griffith

Private Candidates Other
Than Teachers:

Lorna Hyacinth Elistine
Lorna Dossy Herline

Intermediate School:
Charles Miehael Bennett
Eileen Minelva George

Grade of



The Emmanuel High School

Nathaniel Ezekiel Lewis
C'elestine Carlos Veira
Norma Dick
Grace Beatrice Lauretta


...... 3

Local Secretary.


Due to repairs being effected to M.V.
"Madinina", the Grenadines Service
will be carried on by M.V. "Lady Jean"
from the 7th to 29th April as follows:-
Leave Kingstown for Grenadines
Monday mornings return Tuesday
Leave Kingstown for Grenadines Fri-
day mornings return Saturday even-
1st April, 1958.


A new issue of stamps to commemo-
rate the inauguration of the Federal
Legislature in Trinidad will be re-
leased for sale at the General Post
Office, Kingstown, and at all District
Post Offices on Tuesday 22nd April,
1958. The issue will comprise 3 values
only: 3 cents, 6 cents, and 12 cexts.
Colonial Postmaster.
25th February, 1958.


In accordance with section 2 of the
Motor Vehicles and Road Traffic Regu-
lations 1940, it is hereby notified for
general information that until further
notice in the Gazette the period for the

132 SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 8 APRIL, 1958.-(No. 20.)

lighting of Vehicles shall be between the I
hours of 6.30 p.m. and 5.30 a.m.
Acting Chief of Police.
1st April, 1958.


The following articles will be put up
for sale by Public Auction at Police
Headquarters on Saturday 19th April,
1958 at 11 a.m.
I small barber machine
1 pair gents mocassin shoes
1 grey felt hat
1 Tegrov wrist watch
1 Certine wrist watch
1 Timex wrist watch
1 brown purse
1 shirt
1 pair long trousers
1 pair underpants
1 merino
4 handkerchiefs
1 pillow case
1 belt
2 spools grey & red thread
5 pieces dress material
1 sack cement
1 bangle
3 tins nescafe
1 3-cell flashlight
1/2 bottle rum
1 enamel bowl
1 suit case
1 tailor's goose
1 straw basket
1 wood pipe
5 gents wallets
7 boxes matches
1 ice pick
1 pair scissors
5 coloured saucers
1 4-P hoe
1 exercise book
4 small coloured handkerchiefs
2 coloured head ties
5 coloured dresses
3 panties
1 pair gym boots-children
1 pair white shoes
1 pair ladies shoes
1 pair gents gym boots
2 pairs black soft shoes
2 pairs ladies black shoes
2 packs candles
1 Thermos flask
1 aluminum pot containing candle,
onions, cotton thread, hair pins
3 small enamel bowls
1 bedroom utensil
2 pes. green flowered cloth
1 pe. plain pink cloth
1 pc. plain green cloth
1 pc. flowered red cloth

1 pc. flowered green cloth
1 child cream flowered shirt
1 phial containing brown liquid
1 bunch safety pins
14 pieces lead pencils
1 pencil sharpener
1 eraser
1 ladies comb
3 spoons
1 small Aladdin lamp with
2 pcs. cream oil cloth

for Acting Chief of Police.

Police Headquarters,
. 3rd April, 1958.



A.D. 1958.
Appeal No. 2.





On 26th November, 1957 in the
Police Magistrate's Court at Calliaqua
one Nelcia Sutton pleaded guilty to a
charge brought by the Chief of Police
of wounding Alexis McDonald. Sutfon
was sentenced by the learned Police
Magistrate and the informant McDonald
was ordered to enter into a recognizance
in sum of $12.00 with one surety to keep
the peace, and be of good behaviour for
a period of 6 months. Against this sen-
tence McDonald appealed.
Section 19 of Cap. 14 of the Laws of
St. Vincent is as follows:-
"19. Upon the hearing of any
complaint in respect of a summary
conviction offence, whether the com-
plaint be dismissed or the defendant
convicted, the Court may order any
party thereto, whether complainant
or defendant, in lieu of or in addi-
tion to any other punishment to which
lie may be liable, to enter into a recog-
nizance with or without a surety or
sureties, to keep the peace and be of
good behaviour."
The question for me to decide is
whether the learned Police Magistrate
was entitled under section 19 to convict


the appellant. The learned Police
Magistrate in his reasons refers to him
as the "virtual complainant" and the
appellant was of course the informant.
Section 2 of Cap. 14 states that
" 'Complainant' includes any infor-
mant or prosecutor in any case relating
to a summary conviction offence." Now
as Section 19 refers to the complainant,
it might appear at first sight that
McDonald, the informant, was rightly
My first observation is that Section 19
is a penal section and therefore must be
strictly construed.
Secondly "includes" in section 2 ob-
viously means "may include" as an ex-
amination of the seAtions in which the
word "complainant" is used in the
Ordinance reveals. So in section 35
where a complaint may be brought
where there is reason to fear that the
defendant may do the complainant some
bodily injury the Court is given power
to bind over defendant to be of good
behaviour towards the complainant.
Here the word "complainant" obvi-
ously means the person who is alleging
that the defendant has threatened him
or her. Such person is the informant
but may or may not be the prosecutor.
In other words the word "includes"
in section 2 is a term of enlargement and
is not imperative.
In Mellows v. Low (1923), 1 K.B. 522,
D.C., McCardin, J., at p. 526 says:-
"Para (g) [of Section 12 (1) of
the Increase of Rent and Mortgage
Interest (Restrictions) Act 1920 -;
amended by Section 1 of the 1935
Act] says that '...the expression
'tenant' includes the widow of a ten-
ant.. .who was residing with him at
the time of his death, or, when a
tenant. . leaves no widow or is a
woman, such member of the tenant's
family so residing as aforesaid. .' In
my view the word 'includes' as used
in para (g) is not a term of limitation
or precise definition; it means what it
s;ays-that it includes the matters
thereafter mentioned; in other words
it is a term of enlargement rather
than of restriction".
in Dilworth v. Stamp Commis'sioners
(1899) A.C. 99 the Court said "The
word "include". .may h), equivalent to
'mean and include', and in that case it
may afford an exhaustive explanation of
the meaning which, for the purposes of
the Act, must invariably be attached to
these words or expressions."

meanings or it may on the other hand,
have all of those meanings.
It only bears all those meanings if
the definition section is imperative or
the context in which the word is used
makes it clear that it bears all those
meanings. Words must be held to mean
what they ordinarily mean, unless there
is anything in the context to show an-
other permissible interpretation is indi-
cated. Complainant ordinarily means
"prosecutor". And I am fortified in
the instant case that complainant means
prosecutor and prosecutor only, be-
cause of the context in which it is used
in section 19, namely, in conjunction
with the words "any party thereto". An
informant is not a party to a case. He
may be, but he may also be only a wit-
ness as indeed he was in this case.
I am, therefore, of opinion that this
appeal should be allowed and the con-
viction quashed.

Puisne Judge.
8th February, 1958.


IN THE MATTER OF the Estate of
H. Da Souza, deceased, a former
employee of Orange Hill Estates Ltd.,
IN TIHE MATTER, OF the Workmen's
Compen:x.'io: orcBi::a .-' 1939, No. 21
of 1939.

thm, sum o0 one thousand two hundred
and fifty-&sveni dollars and sixty cents
has been paid to the Registrar by the
Orange Hill Estates Limited on the 25th
day of March, 1958 in trust for the de-
pendents of the late H. Da Souza.
All persons claiming an interest in
this fund or otherwise interested in its
distribution are hereby summnnoned to
appear before the Commissioner on
Saturday the 19th day of April, 1958,
at the Registrar's Chambers, Kingstown
at 10 o'clock in the forenoon.


Registrar, Supreme Court.
April, 1958.


I interpret these Jndgments to mean The Public is hereby reminded that
that where a definition section gives to within recent months there has been a
a word several meanings it may have in shortage of water which has been
any particular section only one of those intensified by drought.


2. All persons are therefore re-
quested to exercise the greatest caution
in the use of water so as to conserve
whatever is available.

5. At standpipes, the practices of
watering animals, washing clothes, bath-
ing and allowing the standpipes to run
after receptacles for collection of water
are full, are all offences punishable un-

3. It has come to the notice of the der the Water Ordinance.
Public Works Department that persons 6. The public is therefore requested
are using water from the Distribution to cooperate with the Department in its
System for commercial irrigation pur- efforts to minimise the waste of water
poses. This is a contravention of the i during this period of shortage.
Water Ordinance and legal action will
be taken against offenders. R. G. SMITH,

4. The use of garden hoses is pro- Superintendent of Works.
hibited until further notice. 1st March, 1958.

[ Price 24 cents. I



1958, No. 15.



(Gazetted 8th April, 1958).

1. Short title. These Regulations may be cited as the Motor Vehicles
and Road Traffic (Amendment) Regulations, 1958, and shall be read as one with
the Motor Vehicles and Road Traffic Regulations, 1940, made by the Governor in
Council on the 9th day of December, 1940, (hereinaftei referred to as the principal
Regulations) and all amendments thereto.

2 Regulation 19 (4) of principal Regulations amended.
Paragraph (4) of Regulation 19 of the principal Regulations is hereby amended
by deleting the figures and word "158 inches" appearing at the end thereof and
substituting therefore the figures and word "172 inches".

3. Commencement. These Regulations shall be deemed to have come
into force on the 1st day of April, 1958.

Made by the Governor in Council under section 78 of the Motor Vehicles and
Road Traffic Ordinance, 1940 (No. 20 of 1940) this 5th day of April, 1958.
Clerk of Executive Council.

[ Price 4 cents. ]
1958. .



7th Sitting

Thursday, 6th March, 1958.

The Honourable Legislative Council met at 10.00 o'clock this morning.

[MR. PRESIDENT in the Chair]

His Honour A. F. GILES, Administrator.

The Honourable B. F. DIAS, Crown Attorney
,, ,, B. R. THOMAS, Financial Secretary
,, ,, A. C. CYRus, Second Nominated Member
,, r E. T. JOSHUA, Minister for Trade and Production
,, 9, E. S. CAMPBELL, Minister for Communications & Works
,, H. A. HAYNES, Minister for Social Services
,, ,, L. C. LATHAM, Member for South Windward
,, ,, S. E. SLATER, Member for North Leeward
,, ,, H. F. YOUNG, Member for South Leeward
,, ,, MRS. I. I. JOSHUA, Member for North Windward.


The Honourable E. A. C. HUGHES, First Nominated'Member (Excused)
,, ,, C. L. TANNIS, Member for the Grenadines
.. A. B. DosSANTOs, Third Nominated Member (Excused).

The President opened the meeting
with the reading of prayers of Council.

The Oath of Allegiance was taken by
the Honourable Crown Attorney who
was absent on Vacation Leave from the
opening session of the new Legislative

The Minutes of the Meetings of 6th
and 10th February, 1958, copies of
which were circulated, were taken as
read and were confirmed after having
been amended to insert the President's
name first among Members present.
MR. PRESIDENT: Honourable Mem-
bers I have the following announcement

to make: I have received from the
Clerk of the Legislature of British
Guiana a copy of a Resolution which
was passed by the Legislative Council of
British Guiana on the 12th February,
which reads as follows:-
RESOLVED, that with the arrival
in Trinidad of Lord and Lady Hailes
on Friday, the 3rd of January, 1958,
and the inauguration of the new Fed-
eration of the West Indies, this House
places on record its congratulations to
the people of the ten island territories
and to their leaders who, during the
last ten years, have toiled unceasingly
towards this end; and sends its good
wishes to the Governor-General for a
happy and successful term of office,
and to the leaders and people of the
West Indies for success in every
sphere of Federal endeavour, includ-
ing the early achievement of Dominion
status, and expresses its appreciation
of the desire and efforts by West
Indian leaders over the years to se-
cure the participation of this Colony
in the Federation, and for enabling
us to participate in 'those Federal
services in which this Colony is inter-
ested ;
that this Council directs that a copy
of this Resolution be forwarded to
the Governor-General of the West
Indies, to each island legislature and
to the Secretary of State for the Col-
Passed the Legislative Council on
the 12th day of February, and. signed
by the Clerk of the Legislature.
There are no petitions, I call upon
the Honourable Crown Attorney to lay
dent, Honourable Members, I have the
honour to lay on the Table:

Council Paper No. 6 of 1958: The
Colonial Hospital (Amendment)
Council Paper No. 7 of 1958: Report
of the St. Vincent Public Library
for the year 1957.
Council Paper No. 8 of 1958: The
Federal Elections (Modification of
Local Laws) (Amendment) Regula-

MR. PRESIDENT: As the Honourable
Member for the Grenadines is not in his
place, the question standing in his name
cannot be asked.
I call on the Honourable Member for
South Leeward to ask the questions
standing in his name.

HON. H. F. YOUNG: Mr. President,
Honourable Members:
Will the Minister for Social Ser-
vices please state whether the Minister
for Communications and Works on
his recent visit to England approach-
ed the Secretary of State for the
Colonies with a view to making the
Kingstown Woodwork Centre a Grade
I School, so that the services of the
Specialist Teacher might be retained.
If the answer is in the affirmative, did
the Secretary of State grant his ap-
proval? if the answer to this also is
in the affirmative, why has not the
Specialist Teacher yet been trans-
ferred back to the Kingstown Wood-
work Centre.
HON. H. A. HAYNES: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, the answer is in
the negative.
The Delegation on its recent visit
to England posed the question as to
whether Specialist Teachers (not spe-
cifically assigned to a school, as in the
case of the Woodwork Instructor, the
Home Economics Instructress, etc.)

were not entitled to an increase of
emoluments similar to those recom-
mended by Petter for other Teachers
in the same Grade. As this question
could not have been immediately
answered, provision of the amount
necessary to implement this was made
in the Grant-in-Aid (See Head 9,
item 31), but was reserved until an
actual decision was made by His Ex-
cellency to whom the matter has been

HON. H. F. YOUNG: Mr. President,
Honourable Members:
How many teachers of all ranks
have been transferred since the last
school term of 1957.

MR. PRESIDENT: Honourable Mem-
bers, as the question of transfers is a
matter of establishment I shall answer
this question myself:
The total including student teachers
and pupil teachers is seventy-seven. I
am providing the Honourable Member
with a breakdown of these figures with

MR. PRESIDENT: I call on the Hon-
ourable Member for North Leeward to
move the first motion standing in his

HON. S. E. SLATER: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I beg to move the
motion standing in my name:
WHEREAS the population of Rose
Hall has so increased, outnumbering
the population of Troumaca,
AND WHEREAS the distance from
Rose Hall to Tronmaca is about three
miles which makes it difficult when
the sick must seek medical care, es-
pecially with very young infants,
BE IT RESOLVED that Government
build a clinic at Rose Hall where the

doctor may hold his surgery thereby
alleviating the hardships now exist-
Mr. President, Honourable Members,
I brought this motion here not because
I would like to put any pressure on the
Government at this moment, but when
one considers North Leeward, for the
past years it was given a very dirty
deal. I must say, very little considera-
tion was given to the people of those
areas. When it comes to people who
might be sick, it used to be so difficult
for them even to see a doctor much more
to get to the Colonial Hospital. As a
matter of fact, it took them four to five
hours from Chateaubelair in an open
boat in the sun, rain or storm. Well
Rose Hall is similar; if one gets ill there,
one must get some bamboo or some piece
of bag to make a stretcher, because I do
not think that Government went out of
their way to see that the people even
had a stretcher to take their sick to the
clinic. Well when one looks back, Mr.
President, seeing the march to time and
everybody likes some measure of atten-
tion, I think the time is now, when all
these remote spots be given a chance;
and I think they should be given the
best chance, that is, to put the best into
these areas. For that reason when you
do that, you will be including all these
people who never had a chance to meet
others in the town, so that whenever
they get among other people they can
defend themselves and look like other
people, because they had the same at-
tention paid to them. I personally,
knowing the situation of the budget, can
only ask Government to implement this
as soon as possible, because I think it is
well worth while and more or less long
overdue. As I said, I am not prepared
to put any pressure on Government,
but I am asking that as soon as possible
they would be prepared to errect this
clinic, because lots of mothers and
fathers are not happy when their young-
sters who are not able to express how

they feel, to pick them up in their arms
and maybe through rain or storm,
walking three miles to Troumaca to the
clinic. With. that, I will leave this
motion in the hands of Government with
the expectation that something will be
done as soon as possible.

HoN.. H. F. YOUNG: Mr. President,
I rise to second this motion.
As the mover said, there is no pressure
on Government. It is a sad thing that
the mover did not bring this to Gov-
ernment's notice before the estimates,
because I believe they would have been
sympathetic; but knowing the terrain
as- much as I do, and Rose Hall by virtue
of the topographical set up from Trou-
maca, I am trying to see how easy it
can be for this Government, that is, the
doctor is there and I believe that the
small rental of. a building kcan serve the
people up there for the time being until
such time that they can build some-
thing; but it is definitely a necessity.
Today we do not stand here opposing
just for the sake of doing so, but for
humanity's sake and when rain comes
sometimes the sick might be reluctant
to come down. And I believe from the
miscellaneous votes and from certain
other heads the Financial Secretary-a
member of the Executive Council-can
find $5.00 per month or something pro
tem, so that the doctor can attend the
sick at Rose Hall and a little later they
can send their children down for the
medicine until such time that the Gov-
ernment can place in the estimates a
good clinic. I. thank you.

HoN. H. A. HAYNES: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I beg to move an
amendment to this motion and I hope it
will be accepted by the mover:-to read
in, the place of-
BE IT RESOLVED that Government
build-a clinic at Rose Hall where the
doctor may, hold his surgery thereby

alleviating the hardships now exist-
to read-
"BE IT RESOLVED that sympathetic
consideration be given by Government
in the next development programme
to the building of a clinic at Rose Hall
where the doctor may hold his surgery
thereby alleviating the hardships now

HON. E. S. CAMPBELL: Mr. Presi-
dent, Honourable Members, I rise to
second the amendment presented by the
Honourable Minister for Education and
Social Services. The motion as stands
WHEREAS the population of Rose
Hall has so increased, outnumbering
the population of Troumaca.
AND WHEREAs the distance from
Rose Hall to Troumaca is about three
miles which makes it difficult when
the sick must seek medical care, es-
pecially with very young infants,"
that part of the motion has been accep-
ted by this Government. Now the Re-
solve as stated by the Honourable Mem-
ber for North Leeward requires Gov-
ernment to build a clinic at Rose Hall-
and I add the word which is understood,
'immediately;' but the Honourable
Member for North Leeward is experi-
enced enough in matters affecting Gov-
ernment to know that a budget has re-
cently been passed in which every
project has been itemised for the year
1958. The Honourable Member for
North Leeward also realises that this
motion could have been dealt with out-
side the Council Chamber for the simple
reason that he has made approaches with
regard to several matters for the Village
of Rose Hall. North Leeward is a big
constituency and the Honourable Mem-
bher representing Rose Hall, has asked
for a road at Rose Hall, a clinic at Rose

Hall, and a school at Rose Hall. At
the same time this Government has
actually accepted the change of the
road scheme, which consists of a road
scheme to benefit North Leeward by oil-
ing the road from Barrouallie to as far
as where 60,000 can take us, of the
North Leeward Highway.
Well with all that in store for North
Leeward, it seems that we have to take
them one by one, and working out that,
we would eventually be able to solve the
dilemma of the Member for North
Leeward in having Rose Hall properly
equipped with all its present require-
ments; therefore I strongly support the
Minister for Social Services and ask that
this House deletes from the present
motion the words from-
"Be it resolved . down to the end,
and replace it by the words-
"BE IT RESOLVED that sympathetic
consideration be given by Government
in the next development programme."
because this Development Programme is
already clustered with projects through-
out the length and breadth of St. Vin-
cent. Therefore it is only right and
reasonable that we consider in the next
development programme the position
of Rose Hall along with all other areas
in St. Vincent that need sympathetic
consideration. I'thank you.

HON. S. E. SLATER: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, while I accept
the amendment to this motion, I also,
instead of the next development pro-
gramme, would like to change that to
''as soon as possible."

HON. H. F. YOUNG: Mr. President,
may I ask a question? Development
programme or the next estimate? As
a little councillor we have development
programme that might be purely
C.D. & W.

MR. PRESIDENT: The Honourable
Member has already spoken. He must
resume his'seat.

HON. II. F. YOUNG: Yes, yes, but .
MR. PRESIDENT: I think the answer
there is quite clear. The amendment as
moved said Development Programme.
That is the answer.

HON. H. F. YOUNG: Of course it is
not my motion.

MR. PRESIDENT: The Government
side has moved an amendment and asked
him to accept it. He has said that he
would accept it, but he himself is not
entitled to add an amendment to the
amendment. The position is whether or
not he accepts the amendment as moved
without alterations.
HON. E. T. JosHUA: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I thought that
this matter would have been a single one.
I also thought that the Honourable
Member for North Leeward now actual-
ly a member of the Government Party
will have some faith in this Government,
but it does not appear so at all, for
this is what is true-if you change the
words and amend them to "as soon as
possible" it would mean the same thing
because, as the Minister for Social Ser-
vices states plainly that sympathetic con-
sideration will be given, and I would like
the Member for North Leeward to know
that this is not a constituent Government
as in the past, every councillor getting
up and trying to do something to hood-
wink the public by putting everything in
one constituency. North Windward-
not a single thing was done for seven
years, and when outside the old Govern-
ment there in North Windward, nothing
was done. You see recently what has
happened-a place where illiteracy is
rampant, a place where schools are
vitally necessary, but just because the

circumstances related by the Member for
South Windward one would have said
that most of the amenities were extended
to Central and South Windward and
would have seem foolish, but that was a
sure indication of a constituent govern-
nient, and in due course of time, especial-
ly when things are being brought to the
notice of the Government as the Honour-
able Member for North Leeward has
done, we should spare no time and do
nothing else but try and put those things
forward, because it is the people that
matters. I do not see the necessity for
that amendment in the amendment,
because it would mean the same thing
in practice though in words and in
theory it would mean something else,
because as soon as possible and this Gov-
ernment and its relation with the Gov-
ernment Party will spare no time to see
that these things have been put right
where possible. The development plan
has a limited amount of money, because
the Secretary of State truly said, no new
services, just to keep and maintain
whatever services there are. That being
so, each district would be alloted a quota
of that sum and we have got to balance
the budget and the Minister truly said
the experience of Government by the
Member for North Leeward is quite
clear, only how I see it the prosecutor
broke down in which he specifically
prove a motion to draw the Govern-
ment's attention as soon as possible.
The Member for South Leeward has
made reference even to some improvised
clinic to assist and that is a good sug-
gestion made by him and possibility
might be explored to that end.
Mr. PRESIDENT: Does the Honour-
able Member accept the amendment as
moved ?
HON. S. E. SLATER: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I made it quite
clear when I quoted the motion this
morning that I was prepared to give
this Government a chance because 1

know all the ups and downs placed
before this new Government now. By
changing three or four words in this
amendment it would not mean the losing
of faith or asking too much, because the
way I debated my motion shows plainly
that I am in sympathy with the Govern-
ment, well knowing that this motion was
not included in the estimates for this
year. I believe that if a people within
any part of the world try to help them-
selves some assistance should be given
to keep the work up. I will accept the
amendment for more reasons than one: I
as the Member for that constituency
would not like the people to loose faith
in me nor would I try to loose faith in
them. And since I explain what I
really mean I think all will be taken in
good spirit.

MR. PRESIDENT: The Honourable
Member has availed himself his right to
reply, I therefore put the motion as
amended. There is a motion standing
before the House, the motion standing
in the name of the Honourable Member
for North Leeward as amended by the
Honourable Minister for Social Services,
those in favour of the amended motion.
(Vote taken by showing of hands: 9
for, Nil against, abstention 1.)
The motion is therefore carried.
I call upon the Honourable Member
for South Leeward to move the motion
standing in his name.

HON. H. F. YOUNG: Mr. President,
Honourable Members:
WHEREAS there is dire need for in-
creased secondary education ,in St.
Vincent, and
WHEREAS the existing secondary
schools cannot provide the space. for
children desirious of pursuing a sec-
ondary course, and
WHEREAS every year large numbers
of children who pass the entrance ex-

amination to the two secondary schools
cannot gain admittance owing to lack
of accommodation,
BE IT RESOLVED that provision be
made immediately for another sec-
ondary school in this island, and
order to save expense and at the same
time provide for both boys and girls,
that consideration be given to making
the school co-educational.

Gentlemen, this also is a motion that
comes in the mid-stream. Mr. President,
I can remember too well, and I want the
Government on the other side to realise
before I speak that there is no attack, it
is a question of bringing to their notice
something that they themselves, I
believe, would like to see accomplished.
And in trying to debate this motion I
will see how much I could help in assis-
ting to bring this about. Not too long
ago, even in my little time although I
am fairly young, in the early 1926 and
1927, there were three masters in the
Grammar School, the famous Reeves,
Lopey, Potter. In those days and even
before, the fortunate few and the little
middle class enjoyed a secondary educa-
tion. We are now entering Federation
and I heard the President read a Reso-
lution from British Guiana and I had to
compliment it about reaching Dominion
status. What would that mean to us in
the future Gentlemen, Mr. President? it
would mean that if we do not educate
and train our youth, when we are gone
what type of nation would we have. In
asking you about secondary education,
you must realise in this new nation of
ours that secondary education although
it means so much to us here, so far-
fetched from our poor people, it is just
the standard of primary school educa-
tion in England.
This morning over the radio I heard
that the Diego Martin Industrial Boys'
School has been turned into a secondary

school. The Government has realized
that this new nation of ours calls for
education in all forms.
I am appealing to you Gentlemen, that
you are in the majority in the Executive
Council, and I know the leader of the
Government respects education other-
wise he would not have been here this
morning around this Table; and I
know in the early days were it not for
his opportunity to study he would not
have been sitting around there now.
But I must ask him this question, we
are only here for a short while, and
since our constitution has changed from
a Government of assent to a Government
of consent, what foundation are we going
to lay now? Can we not revamp, as I
happen to be a Member of the old Execu-
tive Council, can we not study then
since you bring it as such a deem neces-
sity for our island? You have the
power in you, you can go back to the
Colonial Office with some development
scheme, and where is the man who can
say 'I did not think of that since some-
thing is necessary.'
There right in front of us are build-
ings which will soon be removed-the
gaol to the fort. Pointing to us is a
building that was built at Biabou for a
hospital but was being equipped and
now turned into a Police Station:-we
could well see the place for a Police
Station. I know that the Government
will agree with me that education is the
only vital need for this young nation of
ours; and whereas the economy of our
country now is a little more sound the
driver and the chauffeur's sons are
thinking of secondary education now.
There is an age limit, and because of
lack of space-Mr. President and Hon-
ourable Members of the Government-
because of lack of space, and the Minis-
ter of Communications will know also
and most of you on that side, that when
those children are turned away they are
a year older the next year, and you
know too well when the age catch up

with them, then there is no education.
As far as I see and as far as I know,
the secondary education today is the
only real foundation-a small founda-
tion in the scheme of things. When we
talk about education in its broader sense,
we are not talking about university edu-
cation; we are seeing that the poor per-
sons now :growing their lacatan in Meso-
potamia are making an effort to send
their children to school in buses, the
children have to eat buns and drink
ginger beer in parlours in Kingstown.
We are seeing that because of that, like
everything else, like a style, like ladies
follow fashion, that their brothers and
sisters also toil to help to give them a
secondary education; it is like a miracle
when you think of those people.
I am appealing to you in the name of
this young nation; I am appealing to
you to make this motion a controversy;
I am not saying that you are reluctant,
I am not saying that we will pass it over,
I am saying to you Mr. President and
Honourable Members of the Executive
Council, that St. Vincent has become
ambitious as far as education is con-
cerned; and I am saying that the only
thing that make a people and the only
way that a state can build itself is from
education; then less money will be spent
on the gaol and the policemen will have
less trouble. If we educate our youth,
if we train them, if we give them a
foundation, then you could imagine.
And as one economist said-not I-that
the biggest economy for any country lies
in the education of its people.
Gentlemen, I am not going to continue
talking all the time, because I heard the
Minister for Social Services himself
whose portfolio includes education, at a
meeting of a school agreed that we need
more secondary schools. I am not
saying that it 'should be put in Kings-
town either. What is wrong with put-
ting a secondary school in Georgetown or
any other place. What is wrong with

putting it at Biabou or anywhere you
want to put it, so that some of those
poor mothers can still see their children
back at home. You know what is hap-
pening in Kingstown now, Gentlemen,
that a lot of people from the country
are sending their children into Kings-
town and when those young girls are
left to the mercy-I need not tell you-
some of them have to leave school, that
is a fact. And it is time now with a
full fledged Government and with this
new nation of ours even though you do
not think of it to listen to me on this
side. I am not condemning you, I am
just appealing to you. You can make
shift. It is not the mansion that makes
a home, it is the love in that home. It
is not the type of building-I don't
expect you to find big money to build
great walls and palaces for our second-
ary education. You can find a house
and I believe if you look around'you
will find many houses for Government
that can be made available. For. God
sake, help our children so that this new
nation of ours will be strong. I thank

HON. A. C. CYRUS: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I beg to second
the motion. The Honourable mover of
this motion has certainly made a reason-
able argumentative case, most of which
took the form of an appeal to your
sense of reason and your sense of under-
standing of the situation that exist at
the moment. I wish to Father that I
was possessed of the quality to persuade
you to do something as quickly as pos-
sible, because this is a situation that
has been staring us in the face for quite
sometime, and unless something is done
as quickly as possible a lot of our boys
and girls will be deprived of enjoying a
secondary education.
Now in 1908 our first secondary school
began, and it was started with thirteen
boys. Unfortunately, I have not had

t 9

enough time to do some research so as to
be able to give you the exact figures. But
in 1908 this school was started with
thirteen boys. At that time the school
was where the health office is now.
People became awakened to a greater
sense of appreciation of education, and
as time went on they sent their children
in greater number to this school, and
the result was, they had to remove the
boys from down there and put them
where the Grammar School is now.
Nevertheless, the Girls' High School con-
tinued there until in late thirty's when
they were forced to build another
In this short outline, Gentlemen, you
will agree that the St. Vincent Govern-
ment has noq been sleeping. The St.
Vincent Government has all along had
an eye on educating its children, and as
fast as the population increased they
either improvised or made schools in
order to accommodate them. Well at
the moment I am convinced that the
time is ripe for another such school. The
question of tacking on a wing to any of
the secondary schools I think is a waste
of time and valuable money. That is
what could be regarded as pure impro-
visation which would, maybe, answer
the question at the moment, and then in
another few years we would be faced
with the problem again of finding ac-
commodation for secondary school chil-
Now this year 176 boys sat the en-
trance examination for secondary school.
It is easy to see that they must have
raised the standard, because from 176
boys only 50 passed the entrance exam-
ination and although as low as this
small percentage passed the exam, still
they had accommodation for only 40.
So you could quite see if these 176 child-
ren had passed this entrance exam you
still will have accommodation in the
boys secondary school for only 40. You
have to put that against the background

of things that we are seeing in the
making. It is true that we are grant-
aided, but it is no gain-saying that the
prosperity of St. Vincent is increasing.
We are seeing tangible proof of it every
day, and parents are becoming more
interested in education, and as a result
every man is trying to give his child a
secondary education. That, I am sure
you Gentlemen will agree, is a very
healthy and good sign; but imagine out
of 176 people who send their children
only 40-the first 40-were accepted.
I am speaking of boys alone. You
could quite see that you would be
having far more children of secondary
school age and secondary school stan-
dard out of school than you will have in
school. Therefore it is a problem that
we have to face. Whether you put it
off now or when it is a question for you,
but it is something that is going to
come up every time; it is something that
is like a ball or a cork you keep it
down in the water and as soon as you
take your hand off, it is going to bounce
up again. You have to face it if not
now, in the very near future. That
you have money to do it now, I would
say emphatically "No", but the Chinese
have a way of saying that if a man
is to walk a million miles he has to start
with the first stride. If we cannot
build this school this year because the
estimates have already been approved,
we can at least bear it in mind and
have it inserted in the 1959 estimates so
that in the very near future we will see
something done.
The question of siting this co-educa-
tional school as the motion reads is not
my business, but there is nothing wrong
in my making a suggestion. I have all
along been thinking that there is too
much emphasis laid on Kingstown with
regards to schools and libraries, and all
those social services, and so for some
years now Government and other quasi-
governments have been spreading their

tentacles to the country districts. We
have in the country districts now in
different areas, libraries, something that
was -unknown in past years, and at this
stage I think we can well put a second-
ary co-educational school somewhere in
the country-and that place I have in
mind is somewhere in Central Wind-
ward, Biabou. I say that because I feel
the children from Stubbs back to Biabou
will be accommodated in that school,
Mesopotamia children can go there and
the children from Georgetown can
come down and go there, and every child
would be able to get back to his home
very easily after school in the after-
noons. That will take a load from
these schools, and the children from
Leeward would be accommodated very
comfortably. To my mind, Gentlemen,
that seems to be the solution to this
problem. It is no good keep carrying
up the standard of the entrance exam-
ination to such a height as to make it
impossible for the children to pass, be-
cause it does not matter what you do,
some of the children will pass and there-
fore if we can be more lavish in our ex-
penditure on Education we would have
.everything to gain and nothing to lose.
You know as much as I do that to edu-
cate people make them potent assets in
the community. A bqy leaving school
with a very good education, he comes
out and whatever he goes to do, because
of the intelligence he has, because of his
ability to calculate and all that sort of
thing, he certainly will make a better
artisan than the fellow who did not
have any at all, and you assess the qual-
ity of a place according to the people the
place produces, and we do want to know
that we have the calibre man and woman
who could take his rightful place not
only in St. Vincent but in any part of
the world. We have, been doing quite
a' lot, and much has been done in the
form of education. Much is still left to
be accomplished, and I think it would
rebound to your credit if you can see

your way, if you can spare every nerve,
if you can endeavour to bring about this
secondary school. I think generations
yet unborn will owe a deal of gratitude
to you.
HON. H. A. HAYNES: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, the mover of this
motion, the Honourable Member for
South Leeward knows exactly how I
feel about this matter. Hie knows that
I feel exactly the same as he feels about
it. I am sure that he reads the Vincen-
tian. I will like to remind him that on
the first occasion that a new school was
opened by this new Government at
Sandy Bay, there were two points I
mentioned in my address:
1. that I should endeavour to see that
infant schools are placed throughout the
length and breadth of St. Vincent. The
other point was that we have two sec-
ondary schools built-one for boys and
one for girls. I am sure Mr. President
can bear me out on that.
The mover of this motion was a mem-
ber of the past Government. He was
there for six years. We are only here
for four and a half months. He knows
very well how the wheels of Government
turn. I agree with the seconder of this
motion that something must be done
urgently. I would like to inform him
now that a couple of days ago when the
Executive Architect, Mr. Michael Smith
was here, I took him to visit the Mar-
riaqua site. I also took him together
with the Superintendent of Works and
the Education Officer to the Grammar
School and the Girls' High School
grounds making checks of the possibili-
ties now of adding immediately two
more class rooms to each of the schools
so that when next the entrance examina-
tion comes up every child who passes
that entrance examination will be admit-
ted to the secondary schools: In con-
sidering the building of a school for the
boys and a school for the girls, we not
only have to think of the possible

buildings. The main cost in that is the
paying of staff and the maintenance of
these buildings. Not only the paying of
the staff but in securing of capable and
efficient teachers. Under these circum-
stances I beg to move the following
amendment to the motion. In the place
"BE IT RESOLVED that provision' be
made immediately for another
secondary school in this island, and
order to save expense and at the
same time provide for both boys and
girls, that consideration be given to
making the school co-educational."
to read-
"BE IT RESOLVED that Government
examine the problem urgently with
a view to extending secondary edu-
cation facilities within the develop,-
ment programme."
HON. E. T. JosHUA: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I being an advo-
cate of Education in this House, I must
first of all make some remarks to the
mover of this motion when he referred
to 'sense of reason,' 'sense of under-
standing and pursuation'. I must first
of all say this, that an advocate of edu-
cation both primary and secondary in
this House, none but the advocates of the
modern age, just as yesterday, have not
surpassed that, because those motions of
the old Government that have been re-
corded here, either in the wastepaper
baskets of the archives of this House;
when speaking of things primary and
things secondary, primary things must
come first. This House may find in the
waste paper basket of the archives of the
old Government many motions year in
and year out, when on the other side
there the same advocate grinned as if the
words were tales told by idiots full of
sound and fury signifying nothing. The
same educational problem, when as the
mover truly said, if those years we had

begun to tack on piece by piece, now it
would not have been necessary to meet
the problem; but now the very advOca-te
by the grace of God has become the'
Leader-in Parliamentary terms---6f
the Government. He saw the 'sense of
reason' 'sense of pursu'ation" and 'sense'
of understanding', and less the seconder
really thought he was speaking and
addressing the regime of the old' Gov-
ernment, we are in truth and. in fact
the sense of reason towards education.
Whenr motions were brought here by me
to see to it that primary education be-
comes compulsory, they wrote-"where
will the Government get the money",-
those were the harsh words; But I
know Mr. Second Nominated, Member
understand this very well because he
tried to educate his children' very well,-
that if you have no foundation in A'rithe-
metic in the primary school, then there
is no hope of getting education; but the
question of urgency of a secondary
school, the speaker here was also the ad-
vocate of putting' a secondary school in
Georgetown, but you' will, remember well'
Mr. Second Nominated Member the atti,
tude of the old Government towards
hearing the name of North Windward:
Well even after five years he did not
know the time will catch, up with us, and'
now he sits there and runs his mouth'
about what was advocated so many years-
ago. If we had shared those motions
and' brought them instead of keeping
them there in the waste paper baskets,'
we would have begun to work on' them.
We saw large sums of money wasted" in
wild cat salt schemes in the Grenadines
-thousands of pounds, but nobody eon-
sidered' until now what. was happening
to people's children. But let me' in-
form this House that the money to rmiU
this country must be found' in' this coun-
try. If it cannot be found here-and.
people are sitting tight when they hear
the word "taxation" especially those
who could pay. They send for the big-
gest lawyers to see that- they do not pay


one cent more, although it involves
court expenses. They prefer to give
somebody the money that should actually
be coming to do the things in the form
of services; because we were told in
Downing Street: "do not tell us any-
thing about extension of your services,
tell us about the amount fall short for
maintaining your services." Well in a
civilised country, everything now as far
as I could see is 'wanted duty-free', and
in a place where you must have at least
one hundred and twenty-five thousand
dollars to balance your budget. God
knows how much it would be next year.
And Taxes-nobody would like to pay
taxes if possible. Where is all this
money going to come from, and in truth
and in fact these matters of Legislation
was sounded like the trumpet of doom
in this House especially the primary
This secondary education is a problem
now; but we cannot now in the face of
a planned budget, in the face of what the
Minister for Social Services has said
they were considering before this motion
was sounded that they will tack on one
or two class rooms so that they could
have the necessary space to a point, to
meet the urgency of the moment. But
look at the problem, just recently we
had money to the tune of seven hundred
and twenty-five thousand dollars to im-
plement the Primary award of the
report of Petter. If that had not been
done well then we could have afforded
the secondary school, but that seven
hundred thousand dollars was well spent
in making so far as we have possibly
been able to implement the Petter Re-
port, so that the teachers might be
satisfied so far as salaries and other
amenities for them are concerned.
It is unfair and highly unfair, when,
perhaps because of Parliamentary pro-
cedure based here, to give the public a
reported impression that the new Gov-
ernment have no intention to tackle the
educational problem. I could not be a

party to debate here and take my seat
save and except I remind this House of
these facts not so many years ago.
The question .now as to this amend-
ment-I second it of course-is the term
'immediately'; and another fact is, that
when motions are brought in this House,
the Government must accept those
motions and all the details that have
been included, or place suitable amend-
ments; because the Government cannot
be embarrassed by public sentiments ex-
pressed by debate in this House, when
the movers of certain motions know what
is the true position. Having Treasury
control-the doles of the Colonial Office
-we could just have a few services.
Keep to the minimum and the rest. If
we have a surplus revenue, well then it
would be easy to implement the motions
in special form and just call upon the
Minister of finance, to allocate the aggre-
gates. This side of the House has men
who can well appreciate not only pri-
mary education, but secondary education
as well, and I would like this House to
know that.
The Seconder of the motion, while
tactfully trying to appeal to the Gov-
ernment's sense of reason, trying to ap-
peal to the Government's sense of un-
derstanding, trying to appeal to and
persuade the Government who perhaps
are ignorant of the value of secondary
education, even at present for more
space and immediate space for secondary
education. He turned back to say
"you have not got the money now", and
spoke of the estimate totally embarrass-
ing the Government. But I say this,
that any debate that takes place in this
House that has a tendency to misguide
the public of our intention toward educa-
tion or any project in this country, I
am going to rise on my feet and make it
unmistakably clear. I second the

MR. PRESIDENT: If no other Honour-
able Member wishes to speak on the

debate, I wirn put the amendment first
as against the original motion. Those
in favour of the amendment.
(Vote taken-9 for, 1 against)

HON. H. F. YOUNG: May I say
something before . .

MR. PRESIDENT: Is it on the amend-
ment ?

HON. H. F. YOUNG; It is in regards
to the amendment, it is quite all right.

HON. E. T. JOSHUA: Mr. President,
on a point of order, we are dealing with
the amendment after it has been. put to
the vote.
HoN. H. F. YOUNG: I am not con-
cerned with your point. . .

MR. PRESIDENT: I will ask the Hon-
ourable Member to speak please.

HON. H. F. YOUNG: Yes, yes. In
bringing about a motion of this type the
question immediately I would not
bring it up at all in this House; but I
don't agree with development pro-
gramme. I will prove to this House, and
if we mean well and put politics outside
of it, we would be able to build a second-
ary school from Public Works Extra-
ordinary vote next year. . .

MR. PRESIDENT: Come, come, do not
make a speech . .

HON. H. F. YOUNG: I don't agree
with development programme. I say
next estimate.
MR. PRESIDENT: We will continue
with the voting.
(The Honourable H. F. Young attempts
to speak again.)
MR. PRESIDENT: I asked if any other
Honourable Member wishes to speak,

and he did take his opportunity to speak.
Those in favour of the amendment.
(Vote taken-9 for, 1 against).

MB. PRESIDENT: The amendment is
therefore carried. I will therefore put
the amended motion before the House.
There is a motion before the House, the
motion standing in the name of the
Honourable Member for South Leeward
as amended by the motion of the amend-
ment just carried by the House. Those
in favour of that amended motion.
(Vote taken-10 for, none against).

MR. PRESIDENT: The amended motion
is therefore carried without opposition.


President, Honourable Members, I have
the honour to move that a Bill for an
ordinance to repeal and replace the Sup-
plementary Appropriation ( 1955 )
Ordinance be read a second time.

the motion.
Question put and agreed.

MR. PRESIDENT: Is there any debate
on the Bill?

President, Honourable Members, I move
that the Council resolve itself into Com-
mittee to consider the Bill clause by
the motion.
Question put and agreed.
Council moved into Comniittee.
Council resumed.

Bill reported as having passed the
Committee Istage without amendment,
and report adopted.
Bill read a third time by title and

HON. H. F. YOUNG: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, it seems to me
that this saying about being inside for
six years is going to go on all- the time,
and for the benefit of the public here,
let me explain to the- Minister . .
MR. PRESIDENT:. I must ask the Hon-
ourable Member to remember that as far
as the Members of the House- are con-
cerned, the public has no ears and. no

HON. H. F. YOUNG: Thank you very
Now, Mr. President, you know too
well Sir,, and for the Parliamentary edu-
cation of the Minister for Socialt Ser-
vices,, that we were in Council for- six
years, and so was the Leader for the
present Government; but during those
six years you and your Executive Coun-
cil were the Government. And I heard
the Leader wisely said a while ago-it
is a lovely thing, he who is going to the
sea, Sir, will learn to swim. When he
was on this side and appealing with all
his efforts and asking us,- now he is
saying on the other side Mr. President,
"no money". It is the same answer.
"He who has glass windows should
never through stones." I am so satis-
fied. now because I like the democratic
way of life. But what I want, to tell'
this Government, Sir, is that the Opposi-
tion is here to remind them of the things
that we left there so: that our people
could get it. Not just to continue to have
it inside their view, because Sir, the
Leader of the Government is not new to
politics, he is old. And: since the people
put us here, then it is not fair for any

minister because we have neglected
something in the past, to neglect his
people. Now let me get back to the

Mr. PRESIDENT: I am not clear what
is the point-what is the subject.

HON. H. F. YOUNG: I am going to
come to it right now, Sir. As we look
into the estimates under Public Works
Extraordinary, Mr.. President-and, not
for one moment I was attacking the
Government, as I believe in results, not
cheap talk, because talk is always very
easy to say, Sir-flowery speech and no
flowery speech is easy to say. As I
take up this estimate in my hand, if
you bear with me a little while, I shall
read% it:

Major Repairs to District Dis-
pensers and Nurses Houses $
Major Repairs to Leper Asylum
Renovation of Children's Ward,
Colonial Hospital
Major Repairs to Hospital George-
Major Repairs to Medical Officer's
quarters Chateaubelair
Major Repairs to Clinic Belair
Major Repairs to T.B. Hospital
Major Repairs to Mental Hospital

Major Repairs to Police Station,
Major Repairs to other District
Police Stations
Reconstruction of Police Head-
Alteration to General Post Office
Rebuilding of Boys' School, Fair



Well to get back to the point, you have
there a total of $158,000. The big point
Mr. President is this, having done major
repairs this year, and you bought a
launch this year-all those things you
fix this. year you are not going to fix
them next year. That is why I said not
development programme but the next
estimate. I was not attacking this Gov-

ernment, but I was showing them, be-
cause we all make mistakes, that in the
next year you would not have to do all
those things and spend $158,000. If I
buy a bed this year I wont buy another
bed next year. And when the Leader
got up and tried to tell you and this
House, Sir, that I was trying because of
neglect, it is no neglect; or because I
was in here six years, it is not so. The
constitution changed in mid-stream,
when we were three years inside the
constitution changed and the Ministerial
system came into being. My friend
there being the opposition, your humble
servant here Was not a Minister but a
Member of the Executive Council. My
views then would have been the same as
the Honourable Member's views; but
naturally I had to wait on the majority
to carry. What I am asking through
you Sir, is the question about which they
are saying all the time that we were in
Council for six years, which is not so.
We were in there six years with a con-
stitution lower than this now. The
Leader can rightly claim upon the con-
stitution, although it is not written, as
the Premier of St. Vincent. He has a
full fledged party and by virtue of that
Sir, I happen to know, he and his party
in Executive Council can bring to the
people the same thing that we said we
would bring to them; but now he is
inside he is saying, "no money", we
have to go to Downing Street. Five
years in the market square when the
other Government did nothing and you
were the head of them, Sir, now he
realises that he cannot do anything
himself, he has to follow the same foot-
prints that we left behind. Let me
prove it to you Sir: The schools that
they were to have built when we were
knocking our heads together, the water
schemes that we had to beg Colonial
Office, the poor Ministers went to Down-
ing Street and begged. During that
time the Leader of the Government went
nowhere to beg, he took no interest in

the running of Government; but I am
proud to say this, and I am very pleased
that he has done the procedure, and the
wolf has now become the lamb. Now
we can educate our people and be happy,
we are at peace, Sir, and I am glad I
thank you.
HON. L. C. LATHAM: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I cannot allow all
this to go on from time to time-the
attacking of this Government, the bois-
terous attacking of this Government. I
do hope that the Honourable Member
will not object to the word 'boisterous',
because we have heard the definition
some time ago. Now Mr. President time
and time again the Honourable Member
just keep attacking and attacking,
especially with regards to the estimate.
He has read out over one hundred and
fifty-seven thousand dollars for repair-
ing of buildings etc. etc. and I cannot
understand; but he carefully left out-
the last time he was in the Budget Ses-
sion he said that the Minister for Trade
took all the money and put it in the
repairing of buildings and building
police station etc. but all that money-
the whole five million dollars in our
estimate is money for the people. It is
the labourer who is going to benefit from
the money. Repairing buildings, repair-
ing streets etc. it is the labourer who is
going to get it. What I was looking out
to hear him read was from Head 2 in
the estimate. He did not read it out,
because he has about $1800 under that
Head 2 that the Minister went to Eng-
land to get for him. He has over $1800
under Head 2.
HoN. H. F. YOUNG: Wait a minute,
on a point of order you must know
better than that, the Minister went to
get something for himself. They get
twenty per cent on their salary, that is
true. Right.
HON. L. C. LATHAM (continuing) Mr.
President Honourable Members, he has

over $1800, and the Minister for Com-
munications has only $4,000. The Hon-
ourable Minister for Communications
went to England to get that for the
Honourable Member for South Leeward;
but why he does not say 'let us take that
money-the stipends he gets, and put
it on the public Service or the Public
Assistance Funds.' We would prefer
him to say that. He just keeps ham-
mering and hammering and I can't
understand him. It is time for the
Member for South Leeward to realise
the working of Government. He knows
the running of Government, and all the
meandering and plaguing and barking
is quite unbecoming.
You know that the Governmenut in
power is just 4 months old, you know
it, and it sounds so ridiculous for intelli-
gent people to hear you getting on like
this as though the Minister has this
money locked up and he refused to
spend it. And the easier you could
take it Mr. Member for South Leeward,
is the better it is for you.

HoN. A. C. CYRus: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, It is time that
we call halt to this question of "just
getting into office." From the time we
have representative government, the
people's representatives have been look-
ing around and you see something done.
The day when you will not see room for
improvement is the day when the world
will be sunk into oblivion-everybody
dead. Therefore it does not matter if
this present Government remain until
another fifty years, when the other
people get in they will still have to ask
for further improvement, because as
time goes on there will be need for
further improvement, and it must be
said, Sir, that whenever anybody comes,
irrespective of if that person was in the
Government all these years, or not, if
that person brings a point for improve-
ment, it does not necessarily mean that

he should have done it in his time, be-
cause when all of us are dead there will
still be room for improvement. And if
the people were elected and put here
around this Table to serve the people,
the day when they stop advocating the
interest of the people is the day that
they will be losing interest in the people
and the place that gave them power.
That is to be made quite clear.
Another point that I will like to men-
tion, lest it be misunderstood: I do not
like the point about Head 2 that the
last Honourable speaker mentioned; be-
cause Head 2 deals with the stipends
of everybody around this Table, and the
question of saying that the Honourable
Ministers along with the Financial
Secretary went to Downing Street to
get money to pay any particular indi-
vidual is not the case. And here it is
actually in a pool, and salaries are paid
from that pool. Nobody here would
have come to this suggestion of any
delegation going to Colonial Office to
ask for salaries for Members here around
this Table. For that matter Members
around the Table might have had to
revert to the days of old when men
served just for love of country. On
that point, Gentlemen, I say that is not
good, unless it be misunderstood I want
to make it abundantly clear that this is
not so. When I was in this Council in
1951, Members were given something,
and I know before a matter of about
twenty years-Members of Council were
paid, but at that time they were not
paid any money that came from Down-
ing Street, they were paid from the
revenue of the colony, and up to 1951
this country was solvent, and Members
of Council were paid. Therefore it is
not true to say that the delegation went
to England for money to pay indi-
viduals. I do not agree with that,
Sir, and it is my reason for reiterating
this, and it is the same reason for my get-
ting up. I want to erase that from the

minds of anybody who might take liter-
ally what the last speaker had to say
on that.

HON. E. T. JOSHUA: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I would have
taken the Minister for Communications'
word and let this be the rising of Council
sine die, but some men come around this
Table and pretend that they bring mo-
tions here to serve the purpose of the
people. We now know that there are
men who with animosity in their hearts
against this Government, come here still
insisting to twist what is being said. I
believe that Mr. Latham, the Member for
South Windward, his language is very
simple that all can understand. It is
not true to say that, in the language
which I heard him speak, he said money
was sent from Downing Street to pay
Councillors. It is unfair to give this
House the impression, and for Hansard
to record that type of thing, and the
public may get a wrong impression of
what the Honourable Member meant to
construe. The question again is that
everybody knows the Member for South
Windward by now, I would not take
him at face value as the others. But
what we have to consider here now is
that a person can come to the Legisla-
tive Council when it suits his purpose
to contradict and stifle down the plans
that were conducive, without taking
notice of them, and then turn back and
convince the public after the tables turn
against him, he comes to this House with
any sincerity of purpose to advocate
the right of this Colony. But the ques-
tion is, and I would like the Second
Nominated Member to know this, that
whatever was done in the past, or was
not done, the past must be looked into,
because no one can look to the future, or
appreciate the present unless he had the
history of the past. And it is true to
say that if we could have seen just
enough in the past what was right to be
done, we would have been in a better

position now to fulfil the end so that we
would have nothing left over to be done.
It is true to say that whatever may be
expressed here this morning, the Gov-
ernment and its method and policy
cannot change; so I do not know why
the Member for South Leeward always
try to deceive somebody, because you
get money and you spend it; you get
money and you spend it in one area and
that needs some understanding and
planning Mr. Second Nominated Mem-
ber. You cannot go on trying to con-
vince the public that there would be no
time or space for proper planning when
you say you are tired hearing this ques-
tion reiterated about just coming into
office. It is true to state that if a Gov-
ernment must function orderly and
properly they must prepare a plan.
You have something of the architectural
idea being in the Central Housing and
Planning Authority, and you cannot go
and lay down a scheme or a set of houses
without first spending a few months at
least to think of the site and to plan for
the building of those houses; or else if
you attempt to do that, it would be
chaos. Therefore it is true to say, as I
have said just now, that in debating
such a motion I would not take my seat
here when men are out to twist the facts
and give a wrong impression to the
public, either in hansard or in the press.

President, Honourable Members, I would
like to explain what happens regarding
C.D. & W. grants and Public Works
Extraordinary expenditure as there ap-
pears to be-some misunderstanding about

It was suggested that a new school be
built with money provided under the
Public Works Extraordinary Estimates.
Now this is only possible in Territories
which are not grant-aided and who are
able to make their own contribution to
the development programme, In some

cases they contribute say 75%, 50% or
25% of the total cost of a scheme and
the remainder is found from the
Colony's total C.D. & W. allocation ap-
proved for that Colony. The Public
Works Extraordinary expenditure is
therefore, in effect, reduced by the
amounts the Colony contributes to the
various C.D. & W. Schemes. An exam-
ple of how this works in St. Vincent is
the Arrowroot Research Scheme to which
this Colony contributes about 25% by
way of staff and other services provided
in the ordinary departmental estimates
which however are not increased to en-
able this contribution to be made-We
give up those services temporarily as a
contribution to the scheme which is the
only one in which a contribution is made
by the Government.
All other C.D. & W. schemes in St.
Vincent are financed entirely by
C.D. & W. grants since we have not the
money with which to make a contribu-
tion. The total C.D. & W. allocation is
fixed by the Secretary of State in ac-
cordance with the principles governing
such allocation throughout the Common-
wealth and all our development work
must be financed within the total alloca-
tion. If therefore we were allowed to
include entirely new works which would
come within the description of develop-
ment in the Public Works Extraordinary
Estimates it would mean that our
C.D. & W. allocation would be increased
'by means ;of a supplementary grant
through the grant-in-aid which would
have to be increased accordingly. In
other words our development programme
would be financed from two different
sources-C.D. & W. funds and grant-in-
aid of administration, and we cannot
have it both ways. The items we can in-
clude under the Public Works Extra-
ordinary Estimates must therefore be
confined to normal replacements of
vehicles and plant or works which are in
the nature of major repairs to or re-
construction of existing buildings etc.

HON. H. F. YOUNG: On a point just
for education, would you mind if I
asked a question ? I am not contradic-
ting you.
MR. PRESIDENT: In the case of an in-
terruption, the speaker may or may not
give way.
HON. H. F. YOUNG: Yes, yes, it is
just for one minute.
With our new Federation, we have a
Government, you know advocation is
necessary, do you think that the
C.D. & W. policy will be the same in the
Federation ? I just want to know.
would have to be unless they change the
C.D. & W. Acts under which grants are
HON. H. F. YOUNG: And would they
change it? I would like to know.
depends on the view taken by Her
Majesty's Government, but I would say
that it is unlikely that a fundamental
alteration of this kind would be made
at the request of a single government
since such a change would affect all the
many Territories receiving C.D. & W.
grants. What I would like to make
clear is that the Ministers on my right
have to allocate C.D. & W. funds in ac-
cordance with the law governing such
grants and to use the grant-in-aid of
administration according to the condi-
tions under which grants-in-aid are
made and these preclude new develop-
ment projects being included in the
Public Works Extraordinary Estimates.
It is not their fault that they cannot do
this; they have to work within the limi-
tations I have tried to explain to the
Ma. PRESIDENT: If no other Honour-
able Member wishes to speak on the ad-
journment, the House stands adjourned.
Meeting adjourned at 11.45 a.m.

Publications Not Available

Saint Vincent Government

v. 91 no. 20

Bill: Bill for an ordinance further to
amend the registration...

University of Florida Home Page
© 2004 - 2010 University of Florida George A. Smathers Libraries.
All rights reserved.

Acceptable Use, Copyright, and Disclaimer Statement
Last updated October 10, 2010 - - mvs