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SUBJECT: Mrs. Marie Dickinson

Miss Lona Blanton

INTERVIEWER: Steven Kerber

DATE: May 27, 1975 bes

I: Today is Tuesday, May 27, 1975. My name is Steve Kerber and

I'm going to be interviewing Mrs. C. P. Dickinson, sister-in-law

of Park Trammell and Miss Lona Belle Blanton, 927 Boardman Street,

Orlando, Florida 32804. Directions.

l/c ^ / W/ t--me /t /,
if you'd like to! t- 1"k you thcr/ first" 1...

I: Well, maybe, we could do that a little later, if you don't mind.

First I'd like to uh just briefly explain to you again how this works.

Um, after we get done talking I take the uh tape deck to Gainesville

and uh it's typed up, so then we have a rough typescript of the

conversation and uh then I send you a copy of that back so that if

there's anything in it that is inaccurate or anything that uh you'd

just as soon delete from it or strike out, youlte free to do that.

And then when you send it back to me then a final copy of it is typed

up and usually, if there's no objection on the part of the person who

has been interviewed then a final copy of it is put in the library

and another final copy is sent to that person. If for any reason you

would prefer, uh, the copy wouldn't; be put in the library, I would

just use the information of whatever you gave me, but I wouldn't even

have to refer to either of them by name.

8: I~ ___ __ -I---,-- ___



I: Uh, so, I thought maybe I could start by just asking a little

bit, well, I, I should first ask both of you your full name.

B: Her name is Marie Dickinson.

I: And your maiden name was...?

B: A _

I: Marie rDt 6v

B: Hmm hmm. ---___

D: _ _ _ _ _

I: Marie?

B: M-a-r-i-e. Marie. A lot of difference. Yes.

I: And your full name is?

B: My full name is Lona Belle Blanton. You see I'm no relation' I'm

no blood relation.

I: Yes, I understand that.

B: I'm, I'm her husband's niece.

I: Yes, I see. I was just...

B: So I'm no blood relation of the family, but I lived with her
and/her husband and it's been fifty-five, fifty-six years, so...

ha, ha, ha. I came from north Florida. So we both _fer____

I: Now, uh...

B: I believe Miss Trammell was born in Alabama, wasn't she? In fact,

I suspect all three of the children were. Now Miss Ivy can tell you,
about that
can fill you in more in detail/than I can. All I know is, since I been

here that I know that Mrs. Dickinson was born in f4pp and

her mother died at her birth.



And her mother's oldpr sister took her and raised her. So that she

was never, she never lived with her own sisters and brothers.

I: I see. What was the, okay, what were the names of your mother

and your father?

Bt Well, her name was Maria, M-a-r-i-a. And his name was Thomas

/ar _______ Thomas Clearton/- $ v

I: And, uh, who was the lady who raised you?

B: Uh, Mrs. Sheperd. Mrs. S. T. Sheperd. Her name was Mary Hammond.

Was it Mary Hammond?

D: Hmm hmm.

I: So you didn't really grow up with the other two girls?

D: What?

I: You did not grow up with the other two girls?

D: No, no.

B: She has a brother. I don't know whether I didn't thought to

mention him or not. He lives in Tampa. Now I was talking to Mrs.

Ivy yesterday morning, she called me up. And I had wanted to have

her down here, as I wrote you. Well, uh, we decided not to have the

birthday party, / / /

AV I Glad I caught you a&hQxDe.

B: Well anyway, uh, uh, Mrs. Ivy said that 0 you would be

e;& to see her.... Well she can give you a lot more detail than I

can. And she said that Mrs., uh Mr. I her brother could give you

even more of the early family background.

I: Is his name Sidney, by some....




B: No, C'_

I: ._1__________

B: Uh huh. T or M S he was named for his father's

father, Thomas 4 ea a", and they always called him 7 C,

I: I see.

B: And uh, he lives in Tampa. And I had invited him to come up

tomorrow but they can't come, they'll come, they'll come in July some-

time, I guess. I don't really know.......... And uh, they have two

sons, one of them lives in Tampa and the other one lives in uh, uh,

Athens, Georgia. He is connected with the college there. He was a

professor, now he is assistant something, I don't know, I don't know

enough about colleges to know. But anyway, uh, and then, uh, Mrs. Ivy

said that uh, I hadn't told her about, hadn't told you about her

brothers. I hadn't thought about all of this, you see. And uh, any-

way, she told her, told you about her brothers, one lives in uh,

Flat Rock, North Carolina and he was in diplomatic service for about
L .It / : 17 1. 1";, I er t
qi/ years, hbae-4ukAB, but he is retired now and he lives ,i'A4 # ,-E

Qa(E Flat Rock. And the other brother lives out here near Christmas,

he runs the iron works, and uh, but anyway.

I: Okay, let me go back a second. There were four children, then;

that your father had all together?

D: Hmm.

I: And their names were...?

B: Uh, Virginia,what was her name? They called her Virtue, but her

name was Virginia...Virginia, I can't think now, but maybe I'll think




of it. Uh, the other, her next sister was uh Persia Safari.

I: Hm hmm.
B: And then the brother,/T. C. Thomas iC, -42 and then,

Marie. And uh, she never had a middle name. But she at one time,

took up the name Elizabeth, but then she dropped it, and now her,

she signs her name, I think just Marie Dickinson...Marie D. Dickinson,

Marie Dickinson, but I think she dropped that, so....

I: And so, uh, Virginia was the oldest.

B: That's right.

I: Do you remember, do you know when she was born. You said she

was born here in Alabama.

B: I would say, now let's see, Mrs. Dickinson will be eighty-two

next month. Her sister was nine years older, her Persia, Mrs. Ivy's

gIBe, was nine years older, and T.C., the brother was six years Ce/l /

than Marie, and I think that Mrs. Trammell was about three years

older than Persia, don't you think?

D: Hmmm .....

B: That's a rough estimate. Now Mrs. Ivy can tell you probably

when. kkinaunj. -/4 a'cI. Yes.

I: Um... whet
Cirt ~whether
B: She has a ftik l I don't know / she's told you or not.

I: She mentioned something about that.

B: Yes, yes. And she has a lot of information that you probably

would have gotten o.t better t her, ha ha, than coming here.



However, we're glad to meet you and and to tell you what we know.

I: Well, this is the first chance I've really had to talk to

any member of either ffy...

B: Yes.

I: ... family, and so that's why I wanted to ...

B: Yes. Well she, Miss Trammell only lived about two years after

I came here. And so, I met her, she was in the home once or twice while I was,

after I came down here. She was a lovely person and a very fine

Christian woman, she and her husband both. In fact, her husband at that

time was the first governor that had never conducted any business on


I: I see. This was a...

B: It had to be...

I: .,. definite policy?

B: Yes. It had to be absolutely um, um emergency. ;r1he-

1' i _eue taught Sunday school classes, she had a

beautiful voice, she sang in the choir, she directed the choir, she
>f~ co/&Ae,
taught Sunday school class gb calgre people. She was a very, she

was a brilliant woman and a very beautiful Christian jvoeor.

I; So you would have met her about 1920, then?

B: Uh huh, 1920.

I: Was she...

B: 1919.

I: ...spending most of her time in, uh, Washington, while her husband

was a senator?



B: Yes. The only time, just about the only time she was ever here,
would be ,. t.;~. /
was when her other sister/ ill, and she aended on her so that she

No// f theNftatt she had uh, um, ___/_/ /_

difficulties and she had to do all that. But other than that, she

was in Washington with her husband.

I: Could we talk about, um, your other two sisters for just a second?

I really don't know, uh, what became of them. I assume both have passed

away. But uh...

B: Yes.

I: Again, what were their married names and where did they live

after that?

B: Do you want me to tell him honey?

D: What?

B: Do you want me to tell him?

D: Yes..

B: Um, she has hEr difficulty in expressing herself, but she knows
what she's talking about. Ha ha.

D: Ha ha.

B: She has a wonderful sense of humor. Uh, well now, Mrs. Trammell

I couldn't tell you where she was married. But uh, Mr. Trammell, uh,

was in, they lived in Lakeland. Did they marry, do you know whether

they married in Lakeland?

D: I guess so.

B: And he was mayor of Lakeland. They started out young in the

political world and he first was mayor there and then I couldn't, he held



several offices and state offices before he became governor and he was

never defeated. The last time he ran was 7L c, (e sJ a c i r- CftnQ

but um, uh after she died, uh he was alone for sixteen years
"9f"iJ __---------- ---^,
and he finally married &fs I A s --

(~ 9A)/7WA)/ unfortunately he didn't get the

right type person. And I don't think his married life with her was

very happy. But he died in office, in Washington.. And uh, then uh, uh,

his sister, Persia was married uh...

D: Himmmm

B: Let me see, they lived in, your father and mother lived, moved to

to uh, Crescent City, but I don't know when they moved there.. Now those

things, T.C. could tell you'll about, 'cause he lived there, his father

married again and that wasn't a very happy marriage in that she was not

very good to the children. But they had a Ci fe" together

and uh, and they lived in Crescent City and and he died in Crescent City.

But anyway, going back to Mrs. Phillips, um, Persia, Persia she married

Geoge Phillips. And .they lived here in Orlando and then they moved to
g didn't they
Cocoa for aWhile,/and then they moved back here and uh, then, but she

lived with her daughter for about thirty years. She had Parkinson's

disease and this rif V Ca 6 )rW a-d/ T

but her home was here for years, in fact she raised, in fact she raised

her family in Winter Park and here.

I: Uh, Mrs. Dickinson, do you have any idea or would you remember
how or when your sister/first met Park Trammell?

D: 7 nd Io iud't k/(no lti,
B: And I wouldn't know anything of that...

D:_ ---- -I---- _, 7- --



B: T.C. would know this, uh huh, he would kno more about that.

I: Did uh, do you know where perhaps, which street they lived at

that time.-./rl Ay/ io/ n)A,(

D: What?

I: ...did they live with his parents or her parents, or do you know

if they moved into a home of their own...in that area?

B: No, I haven't, I couldn't... she wouldn't know about that.

D: __-- ""-'--_-

B: She says her brother would, he, as I was, he, Mrs. Ivy, Virginia,

was saying yesterday morning, she was saying :/ Ct ra

1 ///M i r /LrC orJaall those early...

I: Well I will contact her.

B: Yes, yes.

I: I'm glad to know about that.

B: Yes. I don't know why I hadn't even thought to mention him.

I: Well these things have a way of slowly coming out...
B: That's right, that's right, I, I've been thinking/ him and

trying to think of what could I do because, uh, as I say, I only knew

her a couple of years, but I've known the family and I've known, you

know this and that about them, but um uh, not enough to, to really fill

you in too much on their early life...

I: Yes, I understand Oab

B: ...but you'll get that from Virginia and also if you can, can get

in touch with the brother, uh, he can and and he's extused S5 Cr o OS h

?l qg.. ,J- b r q' "''ut, ha, ha, ha. But uh, he's uh, he's smart.



I: Did uh, Virginia generally enjoy good health or uh was she sort

of a delicate person?

D: You lost me.

I: Virginia...

B: Your sister, Virginia.

D: No, no uh...

B: Well in her early years, I guess she was but she suffered with uh

colitis for years. I don't how many years, but she did, and that was

finally what killed her.

I: I see.

B: She had an attack here and the doctor was down 6WI/ S/C.
I-//) e Ae
C_ fpn And uh, but in her early years she was um, uh strong
and well. Now I don't know whether that started when she was in,/when

he was governor or when...but she was uh, she was the manager of his


I: She was, she did take an active part in...

B: Yes, yes, now I have some um clippings of her funeral and in those

days, they put so much more in the paper than they do now. And that

was in this, these clippings.

I: Yes, I think I've seen it, some of it.

B: Uh huh. You might have seen what we have then, I don't know.

I: tieuh, k~rt VLrg /acn~/^r evidently she was a very well

respected person.

B: Yes, she was, she really was. And she was, she was had to be

well known throughout the state being his campaign manager and he said

she was the best.



I: Um, were they disappointed that they were never able to have any

children, did they both like children? ,

D: "- $Xn\ /(se^ CAb-

B: Yeah, they loved children, but they never had any and they they

didn't adopt any, but, but k/' -' ../ .,s L .5--f.

/ '__S If_ 6 s/. _t she adored her sister's children and

did a lot for them. She saw them more than she did her brother's children.

I: Did uh, r ie, go through grade school or high school

in Lakeland? About how far along did she go?
\/O 4K-
B: Come to think of it ,xea father lived in Lakeland for awhile.

D: Uh huh.

B: for awhile.

D: Uh huh.

B: t y-foir-aaiuh, your mother died or after it? It must've

been before your mother died.

D: I _

B: I don't know when they moved to P 0____ but they were

living in afpoto /' at the time that uh, Mrs. @ry died. And uh,
I / .think
I can't remember now to hear you talking about it,/ toad some kind of a

store in Lakeland.. And so, I don't know hal -of 7ra /}p i .--

---- ,.-/ it) i .1
uh, ... \
I: Uh, did she belong to any clubs/social organizations things ike

that? Was she active in the community?

D: Who?

B: Per, uh, ia.




S j )/

B: Uh, she probably was in Washington "7- 4s t foq /i V6d

I: Did she, uh, enjoy the public aspect, the public aspect of her

D: ( vP// / Hmm hmm.

I: She did enjoy it.

B: Very much.

D: ____-_____"__"________

I: She liked meeting people and uh going to festivities and things

like that. Do you remember who any of her closer friends might have

been, any names at all, of ladies who she was very close to?

D: What?

B: Any ladies that she was very close to, he wants to know if you

know the names of any of the intimate friends of hers?

D: _ _ _ _ _

B: Intimate friends, close friends.

D: Who?

B: Of your sister, Vltrr-.

B: I don't remember either. You see, I didn't, wasn't with her
enough to know/about that and she doesn't remember that.


B: Now she used to visit them, Marie used to visit them wFmdR"nh
I t)
in the mansion at Tallahassee.

I: Ded you visit them in Tallahassee and also in Washington?

B: No, you never did visit them in Washington.

D: A] yI. --77'






I: Just when they lived in Tallahassee.

B: Yes, uh huh.

I: Uh, did uh, Virginia get along well with the Trammell family?

With her...


I: They were all friendly?

B: Yes, she did a lot for his sisters. They were not a L~/v

family by any means, `t *C x,>/ He had several sisters, I don't

remember the names now. They looked to Park, as they called him, for

everything and she was wonderful~--be helper him helping them out and

-- *'" ^****' *'l I - --I n____________

I: You did see them first come out?

B: Yes.

I: After his father died?

B: Hmm hmm.

I: Uh, did he, uh, did Park Trammell really have the remarkable

memory for faces, for names?

D: _____........... __

I: That you read about.

B: Never forgot a name or a face.

D: / --.----

I: And, and that, do you think played a good part in his political


D: Uh huh.



I: His ability to deal with people like that?


B: /J ki:ld t) you and remember your name and when he spoke to

you, he wasn't looking over here for somebody else.

I: --

B: Yes. He was speaking to you directly.

I: Did either of you ever hear him speak in public, give a campaign

speech or any kind of a speech...


I: ...was he, either one of you, was he a good speaker?

D: _____---__------------------

I: Did he have a strong, deep kind of voice.

D: Hmm hmm.

I: Did he have a sense of humor, Mrs. Dickinson?


B: I would say he was a little more on the serious side, the little

I was around him. Uh, maybe a sense of humor, yes, but I, I just don't

remember too much about that, but I do memories very business, uh uh,

business-like, you know. And I don't remember, really, much of uh the

uh f?// A tmor /4e- /e probably had a46Jw times.

I: Did uh, he do anything for uh recreation, such as uh, uh carriage-

riding, horseback riding...

D: s w k

B: No, she wouldn't know about that.

D: -



B: Huh?

D: --'--- I'-V
B: Yeah, Virginia was...
B: Yeah, Virginia was...
I: Virginia was...

B: T.C. would know more about it probably than even Virginia. Virginia

would only know from hearing her mother talk.

I: Uh huh. You said that both Mr. and Mrs. Trammell were very strict


D: Oh, yes.

B: Yes, they were the pillars of that church in Tallahassee and after

- P. :fr' <: was pastor at the time and he says --

--'-__' _he had a beautiful voice, too and they used to sing

khe A- -4 And he would call on her at any time and uh

to come and play the piano, get up and sing a solo, and she was always

ready. 2 4 -^ (i iJA n/ciX 7e6Q / o ir 1(4 C7 .

I: Um, did uh Mr. Trammell quote from the Bible much? Did he, do

you remember if he had a very uh...

B: Do you mean in his speeches?

I: ...intimate knowledge of the Bible, in his speeches, or in any-

thing else?
D: Oh, of course.
B: I wouldn't know about that...

D: -

B: He, he was a great Bible teacher, but he, I don't know about that.

I: Um, he was a fairly large man wasn't he?

D: Hmm hmm.



I: Did he uh, have a a equal appetite, was he a big eater?

D: No, uh...

B: No.

I: Just about average...

D: Hmm hmm.

B: He was a very handsome man. You've seen pictures of him.

I: Yes I have. Was he really as handsome as...

B: Yes.

I: ...as they say he was?

D : .. .. . . .. .. . .. .

----- - more

B: More handsome?

I: Much more...

B: More handsome than his pictures? I think you're right about that,

ha ha ha.

I: Was he uh, emotional, or was he more reserved?

B: I'd say he=was more reserved, yes.

I: Do you know if he read a ot, newspapers and magazines?


B: I'm sure she doesn't know about that.

I: Uh, I suppose he probably did not drink or smoke...

D: Oh, no' Ha -~ .

B: We didn't hear anything like that in the / .'":t'fJ 'u years they

were there.



I: I see. Swi ( /'^ 6w'rio- ,S 4 j{ /

Did they, uh, entertain much at the mansion, do you remember?

D: ------_--_

I: She liked to give parties?

B: Yes...she was a very gracious first lady.

I: Ma'am, do you remember at all if Park Trammell's father, John

Trammell helped him get started in politics. I know that John Trammell

in the 1890s was the superintendent At the hospital at Chattahoochee,

and uh, at that time that was a, definitely a political position.

And /oI thought, perhaps, he might have had some connections to

help him get started or did he just get started on his own.

B: I don't think she would know about that.

D: --- ---

B: But, it it, I didn't know that but I would imagine that that
um was just kind of born in "im, probably.

I: O ./ou1 a/ O # / -

B: Uh huh, uh huh...

I: Um, what did Mr. Trammell call his wife, what name did he call

her ~te?

B: Hmm hmm.

I: Did he call...

B: I think in later years he called her Virginia, but uh in the early

years he called her .

I: Uh, you mentioned that she was his campaign manager. I take it

that he would discuss things with her then and he would rely on her




D: Oh, yes, oh yes.

B: Oh, yes.

I: 'i aners and other things...
more than
B: Hmm hmm. Yes, there's/Qay one person who thought that he

wouldn't have been elect, elected many times if it hadn't a been

for her. Working her wonderful personality and greeting people and

I: Uh, did he take her passing extremely hard?

D: Huh?

B: Did he take her passing very hard? Her dying?

D: Uh huh _--_

B: Very hard.

D: ___--____~_____

B: tO ~-er he was lost.

I: Did, do you remember if he just went straight back to Washington

or whether he went away for awhile, possibly....

B: No, I think he went right on back to Washington...

I: ----_

B: pretty soon afterwards. He was, he was here with her, she was

in the hospital a week or ten days and then he was in our home until

the funeral, and I don't remember whether he came back here or not.


B: But, uh...

I: Would that have been Orange Memorial, then.



B: Yes, yes.

I: ...that she was in? And it was the colitis?

B: Yes, yes.

I: Did uh, you see much of him after that, did he keep in touch

with your family after your sister died in 19202

B: Hmm hmm. Yes, he did. He came back and visited us. Not for any
6 / / r /
length of time, but h C, _t _,_,/ 7_r /_and there were

political reasons why he would just, I don't know whether he ever

stayed with us or not, I know he, I think he stayed with Persia more

than he did with us. You see, they were really closer to uh, Persia,

Mrs. Phillips, than to Marie because they were raised together, you

see, which made a difference...

I: I'm sure it did.

B: ...and the the uh, her aunt that raised her had a son and a

daughter, and they were more like her own brother and sister than her

brothers and sisters were, in lots of ways. Of course there's always

a tie, a blood tie, but at the same time she did, she was not with

them much, she was with her cousins.

I: Yeah, I'm sure that's true.

B: So it makes a big difference, you see.

I: Wilson Trammell is a younger half-brother, I guess you know

is an attorneytB&v3A<, and um, and uh I'm going to talk with him in

a couple of weeks. And he has said sort of the same thing, since he
was raised by Mr. Whitfield t1 married Park Trammell's mother d f

h', John Trammellift l er, he Co_ reol/u d/_ _ __ P5a

Ci AA L...



B: Yes, uh huh, I can understand that. Mrs. McDougall, I would

imagine, could bring you up most date on some of those things.

I: I'm sure Mrs. McDougall could, but she evidently is a very

shy, retiring lady, and so far I haven't HxU been able to uh,

even get her to answer one of my letters.

B: Oh, really. Well now I don't know anything about her physical

condition, I know she is, you know, well on in years.

I: Yes she is. Several people have told me though, that she still

1B in the Flor, Floridan Hotel...

B: Oh really?

I: In Tallahassee...

B: Uh huh. Emma, Emma McDougall, Emma /i~ o cDougall and, but
she would have,/it may be that uh, I just don't know...

I: As far as I know she' still uh writes, she'ehag / 1

B: Yes, uh huh.
to get
I: I do hope/to see her eventually.

B: Yes, well um, um um, I guess she's the only one of his sisters

and brothers that's living, I mean own sisters and brothers ...


I: I believe so...

B: And I didn't know about the half-brother,was there more than one

half-brother or sister.
I think
I: Not as far as I know, he's much younger,/perhaps twenty-five years

or something like that.

B: Hmm hmm.



I: And he was raised by a Mr. Whitfield, I think was c /r o7-"

B: Yes, uh huh.

I: Uh, I have xrd a story that Mr. Trammell, after your sister

died, moved into his office in Washington uh, gave up their home,

or wherever they were living and just stayed in his office most of

the time. Is that true?

D: Hmm hmm.

I: It is true. Did they have a home do you remember, or did they

live in an apartment when they went to Washington?

D: --

B: They lived in an apartment, I'm sure, hmm hmm.

D: ._------_-

B: Yeah, I'm sure they did. No, they never had a home in Washington.

I: Did they...

B: ____

I: Did they come back very frequently to Florida?

D: What?

I: Did they return frequently to Florida when he was in the Senate?
D: -

I: They did. Perhaps, two weeks or four weeks a year, would that be

a fair guess.

D: Hmm hmm.

I: Uh, did you ever get a chance to meet uh, the other Mrs. Trammell?



Mrs. -- Trammell.

B: I only saw her at the at the / ,' .-/

But she was an entirely different type of woman. she was not a

great ( t-_____

I: She, she wasn't the same kind of uh, stF i asset to the, uh...

B: No.

I: Well, uh, there's one more thing I wanted to ask you. Oh, d~s

p(:s, the uh papers that uh are in the library at the university, the

papers right here, there is supposedly a letter, a least it, it's signed

by Mr. and Mrs. &6Lev referring to a loan that they made to Park

Trammell and uh for which he gave them uh collateral of a uh home and

a piece of property and uh, this was in 1934 when the letter was dated,

I don't know if it's authentic or not, and it said that he had been in

uh, uh financial trouble, Mr. Trammell, in that he had never been able

to pay back Mr. and Mrs. -Ga Do you know anything about that?

D: Oh, no.

I: Is it possible.

D: Oh, no.

B: No, I wouldn't know either.

I: I just...naturally and uh...

B: Yes.

I: and I didn't want to...

B: Yes, sure, uh huh.

I: Uh, never think about using it if I couldn't substantiate it.




B: Virginia could tell you more, maybe so.

D: Hm hmm.

B: Even our T.C. would know more about it probably, if he remembers..
And T.C. still has a/good memory although he's, he'll be what

eighty-eight years old in June.

D: .-_ _ _ __-- _

I: I uh talked with a man named Mr. Bevis, Walter Bevis in Tallahasee

I don't know if you ever met him?

D: Who?

I: Walter Bevis who also is eighty-eight who worked for Mr. Trammell

when he was governor. He also r- eQ-l/ aW .( ) ke.rl.

B: Yes, hmm hmm.

I: Well, I'll turn this thing off and uh, if you wouldn't mind

showing me your picture...

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